What's up with the River in Big Box 5?

[chris6507]

Sorry everyone, didn't realise this edition of the river was such a controvertial topic.  I appreciate those of you who shared your opinions about the grey backs, sounds like there's no real rhyme or reason to it. Just a shame the back don't match my river 2.

Anyways hope every continues to enjoy the back and  forth as to whether it's BB5 River or River 3! 

[DIN0]

Oh there is much more about the rivers... but that's for another day.
At the end of the day, there is only one objectively correct answer: River I and River II are official names, River III is not. Happy nightmares River 3 believers 

[Willem]

Define "official".
That is one of the most mis used words out there for many things 
If you mean "as referred to as such by the publisher", there are different things said by different publishers, which makes that a fluid definition as well.
Even C1/C2/C3 was a fan-term, until HiG fully adapted it with the C3 release
Even in doubt if HiG ever referred to the first River as the River 1. I think they just call it The River, and the River 2 as The River 2... (So is River 1 not an "official" name?  )
I'm sure I can get someone from HiG to say it's river 3 

[lr]

In The Plaettchenliste, it's River III   :


https://cundco.de/media/pdf/47/c4/91/Plaettchenliste.pdf

[DIN0]

there are different things said by different publishers, which makes that a fluid definition as well.

I realize it is fluid, but to my knowledge, there is no official publisher who refers to it as River 3 - which is what I would consider official.

In The Plaettchenliste, it's River III 

Only because it's made by fans 

[LaPorxada (aka BigBoss)]

In the Plaettchenliste, it's River III   :


https://cundco.de/media/pdf/47/c4/91/Plaettchenliste.pdf

The terminology in the "Plättchenliste" ist from German Fans from carcassonne Forum - the formerly Forum Admin and founder Maik itselfs adopted this for his tiles list and HiG use this list for the  CundCo online shop.

River 3 is simply a fan designation that neither bgg nor its german counterpart spiele-check have adopted.

Incidentally, I also call the BigBox river fluss III, although there is a lot to be said for not calling it that
For example, in the official German BigBox rules it is simply called Fluss - identical to the Mini: der Fluss, or the Fluss CundCo-shop edition in the punched sheet.


Update: I had issues writing messages here so my message is now partly too late and @DIN0  has already said the same thing in slightly less detail.

@Willem  also correctly mentioned that also river 1 is just a river ;-)

[lr]

This may be fan-made, but it's the "official" document for ordering tiles on cundco... 

[LaPorxada (aka BigBoss)]

This may be fan-made, but it's the "official" document for ordering tiles on cundco... 

ok, if we now stick exactly to the tile list in the store, then I never want to read river 1 anywhere again ;-)

Please don't take this too seriously - I also call the "new" old river River 3 because it's a logical list - but the tile list as an argument stands on "very shaky ground"*.
I suppose, that the descriptions in there were by no means discussed with the publisher.
But you can ask @maik63de or Andreas from the shop - and next year on the Spiel we could also ask Moritz   "haha"

* I suppose this german idiom doesn't exist in English, does it? :-)

PS:
An additional fairy tale  about the "Plättchenliste" on the shop:

Russische Sonderplättchen (Russian special tiles) 

Of course, the reference to Russian versions does not count as an argument, as these are independent Hobbyworld products.

[Scott]

That idiom does exist in English too.

[Death Meeple]

If this is River III, this means I shall add it to my Mega Carcassonne game, and I don't like it because there are already way enough rivers and I have no clue where to place this additional source... An they have the same general designs as the first river so they don't bring much new things 

Now I hope to find it without having to buy the bigbox...

[lr]

The most important thing is not the official name, but the name that History will remember. Here, History will remember that this river is River III   

[Scott]

It was only available in the BigBox, so you’ll either need to buy the BigBox or find someone who is willing to split up a BigBox.

River 3 is an upgraded replacement for River 1. It is not meant to be added to the game alongside River 1. Of course, you may do as you like. One option would be to place the two springs back-to-back so that each spring flows in an opposite direction, similar to the 20th anniversary double source tile.


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[danisthirty]

The most important thing is not the official name, but the name that History will remember. Here, History will remember that this river is River III   

Amen brother!

[Death Meeple]

River 3 is an upgraded replacement for River 1. It is not meant to be added to the game alongside River 1. Of course, you may do as you like. One option would be to place the two springs back-to-back so that each spring flows in an opposite direction, similar to the 20th anniversary double source tile.

I was refering to WICA "Mega Carcassonne" page, with the starting tiles suggestions.
In that case, it is suggested to use the River I, River II and the River from the 20th Anniversary, with their respective source tiles. River III tiles and source are not mentioned (yet?).

Same for WICA "River" page: the way to mix River I and River II (and the 20th Anniversary if I'm correct?) is explained, by using only 1 source tile and one lake tile. River III is not mentioned (yet?) either.

I undertsand that River III is actually an updated River I, and not a new River expansion. But I find it very confusing to name it River III: as River II is named this way for it is a completely new River expansion, naming this updated River I as "River III" suggests it's a brand new river expansion, in addition of the 2 (3 if you count 20th Anniversary) already existing...

I'm a newbie so definitely not familiar with all namings, and I guess everyone discovering Carcassonne as I do would go trough the same confusion.
Names such as "River from BigBox 5" or even "River 1.2" would make more sense to me...

I think I'll join the newly founded BBG Heretic River Clan, sorry guys 
(Maybe our new cult will lead us to use the name "River III" for the River from the 20th Anniversary, beware!)

[Willem]

All you heretics still calling it River 1....
Is like calling the first Lion King movie Lion King 1... There's no such thing!