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Messages - MrNumbers

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61

Here is promised review of the final game.

I don’t remember much from first half of the game, except some separate facts: big city started to grow and it included many trade goods, so completion of it could guarantee trade goods advantage. We put much power into that city, including glomming on, flying into and removing knights with princess, but in the end I left with two trapped meeples and builder. Dan quickly secured this trap by adding a tile above, so I couldn’t even use a bridge (because some crcr tiles were still in the bag). During first half minor castle bug showed up: according to the rules castle can’t be scored in the turn it was created. That’s not how it is implemented in JCZ. We decided to track affected score difference manually, that is why my final score differs from screenshot by 2 points.
As you know, when serious bazaar bug appeared, the game was interrupted, until Decar was able to track down the bug and create unique JCZ edition, and TheSteveAllen properly tested it. Big THANK YOU, guys, for your efforts! The game continues, after I sorted out some personal problems and we at last could find time to play. This second part I started very badly, with my first (!) move I freed up two of Dan’s trapped monks, so on that moment Dan has 5+1 meeples in hand, but I had only 1+1. I really thought the game was over for me after that “move of shame”, but I decided to fight till the end. As Dan already told, I managed to free one meeple by drawing cfrf tile and one by placing cloister near huge besieged city. On a side note: I didn’t understand why Dan kept adding tiles with his builder to that highly unlikely completable city. Just to spend tiles? These tiles gave 0 points to him. Instead he could use his builder to both generate points and leave me less tiles, if builder would be in normal city. It looks like Dan soon enough admitted it by himself, so he also escaped from that city through cloister I placed earlier.
After that I had some lucky draws, including completion of 10-point city with clothes, which turned out to be the only one clothes piece earned in the game (additional +10 points). Game end is perfectly described by Dan. I can only add, that Dan perfectly spotted my attempt to add phantom to the farm (to win it), so he spent his ccff tile not to add to his builder, but to prevent such possibility (and just with my next tile I could achieve that!).
So, Dan really deserved victory, I was almost ready to such outcome, so after game ended I barely believed the result! Thanks for such thrilling game, buddy! And thanks once again to Decar and TheSteveAllen!

62
World Cup 2017 is officially over!
Tonight we finally finished our game with Danisthirty.
Final score:
MrNumbers :red-meeple: 224 : 206 :blue-meeple: Danisthirty

I will do a write-up tomorrow, now it's too late for it here.

63
Friday would be good for me, assuming Decar will approve that the special "JCZ World Cup Final 2017 edition" is ready :)

64
MrNumbers: what OS do you use?
I have Windows 10 Pro 64-bit.

65
Can you confirm you're happy for us to do this MrNumbers?
Thanks also from me, Decar, for you hard programming work. Yes, I agree with Dan, if the bug is completely removed from the game, we could continue, after you with someone else will do necessary test runs.
We must keep in mind castle bug though. But I believe we can control it manually.

66
If this isn't to difficult, please, do it, Decar. And I would like to ask you to do the same in the future with the save file, which I'll do before last tile of the game is placed.
Tomorrow I have National championship, BTW, so don't expect me to respond quickly :-)

67
Here is my story:
I wasn't aware of that bug. To be precise - what is this bug's main idea. I didn't find anything in "JCloisterZone FAQ, Suggestions & Bug Reports" forum, it was only briefly mentioned in Alternative World Cup thread:
Please go ahead and play your 'Final' games as JCZ currently stands. This is not a 'serious' competition for prizes, and is designed for enjoyment only, so I see no reason why we should not proceed with the minor bug that affects the bazaars. The program does not crash, and it will be the same advantage or disadvantage for both players, so I can see no harm in getting our 'Final' matches played with JCZ as it is.
(emphasis mine)

Based on that I let final matches to be played. But in fact it appeared to be a very serious bug, which affects the game in very significant way! In games like Final tile counting is serious part of the strategy. I have counted the tiles and, given that two cfcr tile are gone (2 most left) I created a hole so 2 Dan's meeples should be stuck forever (unless eaten by the Dragon). But in the subsequent turn Dan draw such tile again! And this is the only example I noticed. How could you notice any other such duplicates? The game becomes completely unpredictable, which it shouldn't be by default! Another annoying bug is with castles. According to rules, if castle is created and some feature is scored in the same turn, castle scoring is not triggered. This isn't realized that way in JCZ, which is another bug, not so serious, like the first one, but also could affect the game in serious way (in this game also, actually).
Given all the facts I don't see another option, but to exclude BC&B from Final expansions setup and start the game without it.

P.S. The whole post was written before I have read Decar's last reply.

68
@MrNumbers:

Rosco (I believe) noticed that an old bug has made its way back into the game with regards to the princess and the phantom; when the princess is used to remove the last meeple from a city, the phantom (if available) can then be placed in the city. I always thought this was the correct behaviour but we discussed it a few years ago and it was determined that this should not be allowed. It doesn't break the game, but it is probably worth advising that this should be avoided if the opportunity to do so should arise in either game...

Agreed. It can affect only 2 games, so we 4 should be careful about such behavior.

Just for the record then, this behaviour is officially outlawed?
Yes, because it is against the CAR. We have corrected this bug in JCZ once, now it's back. We should be as close to CAR, as possible.

69
@MrNumbers:

Rosco (I believe) noticed that an old bug has made its way back into the game with regards to the princess and the phantom; when the princess is used to remove the last meeple from a city, the phantom (if available) can then be placed in the city. I always thought this was the correct behaviour but we discussed it a few years ago and it was determined that this should not be allowed. It doesn't break the game, but it is probably worth advising that this should be avoided if the opportunity to do so should arise in either game...

Agreed. It can affect only 2 games, so we 4 should be careful about such behavior.

70
So, now it's time to finish the World Cup 2017 already!
Final match:
MrNumbers vs. danisthirty

Is this Saturday too soon for you? 8)
If I won't be out of town (there are such plans for Easter), then it is possible :D

71
Official Rules / Re: tile differences between old and new BCB
« on: March 25, 2018, 05:16:29 AM »
Topics merged.

72
Today I was busy with big event - my mother-in-law and father-in-law had 50th wedding anniversary :D
Now I had time and added the write-up of our match with Jéré.

So, now it's time to finish the World Cup 2017 already!
Final match:
MrNumbers vs. danisthirty

3rd place match:
Jéré vs. zone2

In both matches final setup of expansions must be used. Let's do it! C:-)

73
Thrilling semi-final game with Jéré.
MrNumbers vs. Jéré
203:178

The start was terrible for me: Jéré drew 5 tower tiles straight, only 6th tile came to me, as a result my 4 meeples were captured early. As a first tile of the game Jéré got cathedral, where he put his big meeple. All my attempts to connect failed - the reason described above. So soon that city just waited for cccf tile to be complete in Jéré's favor, moreover he put Mage into that city, so there were potentially 40 points! My opponent received such tile once (splitter from Festival), but didn't want to give me points too. Then some magic happened: I received one Mage tile - put away Mage, received second Mage tile - put Witch into that city, finally I received cccf splitter and split that city into 3 separated cities, two of them scored by me (10 points) and original city - by Jéré (11 points).
Then some mistakes by Jéré began. Firstly, as he already mentioned, he allowed me to return 2 of my meeples back by placing his meeples near tower tiles. Then he didn't notice that I started to put tower pieces to capture his valuable farmer (just two tiles above my 3-points farmer). As it was almost impossible to place new farmer without being captured, I have put my two farmers nearby and hoping for fffr (2 of them were in the bag yet). It was "all-in". Soon Jéré received such tile, but me also, so 27-points farm was won. Jéré started to do strange things, like capping the tower (south) and placing big meeple on the farm, not realizing that both fffr tile were gone already. Here I must notice another phenomenal luck by Jéré - he drew 9 of 10 festival tiles, so he always were able to retrieve his stuck meeples, while I struggled with meeple shortage (I received my only festival tile early in the game). I even captured my own meeples twice to get back some meeples. Also Jéré drew almost all gold tiles (you can notice our gold points balance).
In the final part of the game we fought for 21-point farm. Jéré put two tower tiles near my two meeples, but didn't want to capture them right away, as it would give me the opportunity to return them by paying ransom. I had only one meeple left by the moment and I decide to put the tower piece by myself and hoping Jéré wouldn't notice that move, and cap it in the next move. I actually succeeded in this, but I have no meeples left. Then Jéré made one more mistake: he put tower piece and captured my normal meeple-farmer (on cfcf splitter Mage tile). That gave me so needed meeple (I had one of Jéré's meeples captured) and I immediately capped that tower, in order not to allow to capture my big meeple. If Jéré wouldn't capture my farmer with his first tower piece, he would capture my big meeple with his next move and would at least equalize the farm, as I couldn't cap the tower (no meeples).
With his last attempt to save the game Jéré put his big meeple near my 18-points farm. As we found out later, amongst 4 tiles, which left in the bag, 3 was rrff curves, needed by Jéré, and one - ffff road splitter (with gold). This time luck was on my side and I drew ffff tile and prevented the hijack. One more attempt followed, this time with normal meeple, and another prevention.
So, I can't summarize it better than Jéré already did: his luck was compensated by his mistakes.
Good luck with bronze game!

74
I have reported the princess and phantom issue separately Stevo
This bug was fixed once, now it returned :o

75
@MrNumbers @Jéré: Do you have a date in mind for your SF yet? O:-)
We are discussing the date at the moment :D

The date at the moment is the 20th March.

Does that help? ;)
OK, you caught me on incorrect usage of articles. Be proud of it :P

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