The Catapult

[BT]

Are there any specific rules about where the catapult is launched from? After reading through the excellent CAR (the detail you have placed in that document is amazing...) I couldn't find an answer.

Is the catapult permitted on the tiles or must it be launched from beside the tiles or from each player's supply?

Linkback: https://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=230.0

[kettlefish]

We have an officially answer from the publisher HiG at the HiG-Chat from 31.10.2008.

question:

And where exactly has to be the Catapult?

answer from HiG:

I cannot give a precise location for the Catapult, since I don't know your table.

The HiG-Chat is the comments function for Carcassonne at the homepage from Hans-im-Glück-Verlag
HiG-Chat

[Carcking]

answer from HiG:
I cannot give a precise location for the Catapult, since I don't know your table.

Sounds like there is no specific limitation then. Likely, there is no consideration by HiG for ternament play so I guess it would be up to house rules.

[BT]

Thanks!

House rules it is then.

[kettlefish]

With the catapult is one rule:
Please don't hit the meeples from the scoring board.

S-CAR6.2 page 85 - footnote 286

[carca82]

Using this topic since already exists instead of starting a new one. I have of course some questions about the Catapult rules.

1. What happens if during a Knock out round, a tower get knocked down? I understand this is how it works: is it correct?

• if the tower was empty, it just gets rebuilt as it was before the attack
• if there was a meeple on it, but the token doesn't touch it and the meeple itself does not touch any other meeple while falling, everything must be reverted as it was before the attack
• if there was a meeple on it, and the token touches it and/or the meeple itself touches other meeples while falling, those meeple(s) get(s) removed

2. Question: "Can the wagon “drive by” a fair, or rather does a fair split a road at all?" Answer: "The fair is a “feature,” so the wagon cannot pass through it." I don't understand what this means, can someone explain to me? Thanks and sorry

3. Just out of curiosity, how many of you exclude the Catch token while playing this expansion? 

4. Was Klaus-Jürgen Wrede drunk while developing this extension?

5. Catch round: can the catcher use two hands or do they have to use only one? I think they should use only one.

[Meepledrone]

Using this topic since already exists instead of starting a new one. I have of course some questions about the Catapult rules.

1. What happens if during a Knock out round, a tower get knocked down? I understand this is how it works: is it correct?

• if the tower was empty, it just gets rebuilt as it was before the attack
• if there was a meeple on it, but the token doesn't touch it and the meeple itself does not touch any other meeple while falling, everything must be reverted as it was before the attack
• if there was a meeple on it, and the token touches it and/or the meeple itself touches other meeples while falling, those meeple(s) get(s) removed

It seems reasonable. It would be a conclusion of the following clarifications:

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/The_Catapult_(1st_edition)#cite_note-4

Note it says that "the special figures and neutral figures on those tiles will remain undisturbed." That mean that the tower floors should not be affected by the catapult and remain as is (even if knocked out). The same would happen to the builder, the pig and other special figures or any other neutral pieces or figures, for example a bridge or th fairy.

2. Question: "Can the wagon “drive by” a fair, or rather does a fair split a road at all?" Answer: "The fair is a “feature,” so the wagon cannot pass through it." I don't understand what this means, can someone explain to me? Thanks and sorry

In C1, the wagon can only move from a road to another one, if they both enad up at a junction. If instead of a junction there is a feature, claimable ot not claimable but triggering or associated to any mechanic, the wagon will not be able to move between those roads: a fair, a bazaar, a crop circle, an acrobat space, a circus space, a tower foundation. This growing number of limitations may have lead to the change in the wagon rules. This footnote on WICA provides a check list of dos and don'ts:

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Abbey_and_the_Mayor#cite_note-19

Besides, this page provides some expamples of the differences in the wagon rules between C1 and C2:

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Wagon_Movement_Rules_Changes

3. Just out of curiosity, how many of you exclude the Catch token while playing this expansion? 

Not in my case. But if you want to get rid of it, maybe you may think of a repacement. Here is an "Invasion Token":
https://forum.carcassonnecentral.com/index.php?topic=1398.0

As you can see in this thread, the "Catch" token is not very appreciated by other players.

4. Was Klaus-Jürgen Wrede drunk while developing this extension?

Being drunk for several months must pay a serious toll. Playtesting this expansions while dunk may lead to long afternoons looking for stranded tokens.

5. Catch round: can the catcher use two hands or do they have to use only one? I think they should use only one.

The illustrations show only one hand maybe for the sake of simplicity, but the token shows two hands. The rules do not include any contraints in this regards, so one or two hands should be okay.

[carca82]

Love it, thanks! We particularly loved the Invasion action, that's now our standard action for the launch token 

[Death Meeple]

Hello,

I'll take the opportunity of this topic to ask a few questions as well:

1) I understand each player, during its turn, can place the catapult wherever he wants on the table / the playing area. Is that correct?

2) The rules don't specify that the catapult should be placer on the table. This means we can use it by keeping it in hands, or even with only a side of it touching the table to get some angle before shooting?

3) The rules don't specify that the token should be placed at the top of the catapult, even if it's the most obvious way to place it. Can we place it lower on the catapult?


Those are small details, but they allow to increase efficiency and accuracy of the catapult... The randomness of this extension is probably one of the main element that kills the fun, these points help make it less terrible imho.

Best regards,

[BBG]

Since I don't think there are official rules for any of these, I'll offer my two cents, i.e. the house rules I use for my games:

I understand each player, during its turn, can place the catapult wherever he wants on the table / the playing area. Is that correct?

yes but being careful that the catapult actually touches the table, even if only by a bit

The rules don't specify that the catapult should be placer on the table. This means we can use it by keeping it in hands, or even with only a side of it touching the table to get some angle before shooting?

see answer above: if any part of the catapult touches the table, that's a permitted position. From here it follows that you can't keep the catapult in hand or suspended over the game table

The rules don't specify that the token should be placed at the top of the catapult, even if it's the most obvious way to place it. Can we place it lower on the catapult?

Similar to above: you can place the token anywhere on the catapult, even the lowest part. But, the launch must be a proper launch, that is: the token must fly in a trajectory, it's not allowed to just let it fall from the catapult or something like that.

As I said, these are not official rules, just some house rules of mine

[Death Meeple]

Hello,

We met this situation during a catapult turn, the knock out token hit a ghost attached to the blue meeple.
It didn't hit the meeple, nor caused a chain reaction : only the ghost gets hit and fall without touching the meeple.

Shall the ghost be removed, or be placed back where it was as it may be considered a neutral figure?

Best regards,

[Paloi Sciurala]

I am not sure, but Game Figures seem to suggest that the ghost should be placed back where it was.

[Meepledrone]

It is not explicitly clarified for the Knock Out token, but the Seduction token and the Target Hurling token had footnotes that state the following about other figures than meeples (followers in C1):

https://wikicarpedia.com/car/The_Catapult_(1st_edition)#cite_note-original-6

Any figures or tokens moved or knocked over by the token should be returned to their original position before proceeding with this action.

By extension, the same action should apply to special or neutral figures affected by the Knock Out token. Therefore, the ghost should be placed as it was if no chain reaction affected the meeple it was assigned to.

[Death Meeple]

In the case of the seduction token: the nearest meeple is removed, and replaced by an other one.
If that particular meeple has ghosts attached to him, are they removed as well?

This would be a way to get rid of ghosts, if a player uses the token to exchange his own meeple with an other one from his stock.

[Meepledrone]

Ghosts would be removed in this case, since they can only stay on the board while assigned to a meeple. If a meeple is removed, all the ghosts addd to it must also be removed.

Moreover, if the meeple you selected to be replace the one removed may also have ghosts added to it. In this case, the ghosts should accompany the meeple.