Author Topic: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"  (Read 5727 times)

Offline Hounk

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Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« on: January 11, 2015, 03:30:43 AM »
  • Is it correct, that the unfulfilled cards have no influence on the determination of the 10 bonus points for fulfilling the most orders? Let's say somebody fails on three orders but fulfills five of the eight cards, he or she draw during the game and somebody else fulfills four quests, and never took more cards, the first person will be "awarded" with a penalty of only 20 points rather than 30.
  • Does "keeping the dragon card till the end of the game" counts as fulfillment of an order in the final scoring or rather not?


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Offline Carcking

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Re: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2015, 07:35:04 AM »
  • Is it correct, that the unfulfilled cards have no influence on the determination of the 10 bonus points for fulfilling the most orders? Let's say somebody fails on three orders but fulfills five of the eight cards, he or she draw during the game and somebody else fulfills four quests, and never took more cards, the first person will be "awarded" with a penalty of only 20 points rather than 30.

We've got several plays of BOotK logged and we love this expansion! We have never played with the end game penalty for holding cards though. We deteremined right off that it was enough of a penalty perhaps drawing poor cards to begin with and not getting the constructive benefit of being able to fulfill them...nevermind being beat over the head again at the end because you are still holding them. Plus it just penalized drawing more cards into the game - which would seem to be the opposite of what the expansion should be trying to do for itself.

But, to answer your question, it looks like the way you have figured it is correcct. Player 1 fulfilled the most Orders so he earns a 10 point bonus. That is subtracted from his 3 card penalty of 30 points to net out at a negative 20 points. Player two receives a negative 10 points for his remaining card.

  • Does "keeping the dragon card till the end of the game" counts as fulfillment of an order in the final scoring or rather not?

Not having any meeple eaten by the end of the game is the fulfillment of this card, so, yes, it is counted as a fulfilled card - lest it be conisdered to still be in your hand and worth negative 10 against the 10 point bonus for still having it. That would make it worth nil and would make no sense, imo.
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Offline Hounk

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Re: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2015, 09:21:20 AM »
The mechanism seems to be borrowed from "Ticket to Ride", where the negativ points at the end are equal to the positiv points you gain during the game. So there it is even more penalizing, because the harder an objective is to fulfill, the more punishing is a failure in it. I am looking forward to try this expansion out in the next session of our gaming group, because the concept seems really appealing to me. I wish, something like that would have been done by HiG with their mini expansion "The Messengers". I already printed both decks on special paper with a color laser printer. It does not look like professional card decks, but come by far close enough, that playing with them should be fun.

About the second question: I did not consider a penalty for avoiding the dragon, this would indeed make no sense at all. And the rules say, this card is an exception anyway. But the "order" says "Show this card if any of your followers are eaten by the dragon." So to speak, the "order" has not been "fulfilled". I understood the rules that way, that you get your ten points for not fulfilling the order but therefor can not count it to your score of fulfilled orders for the determination of the ten extra points.

Offline Carcking

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Re: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2015, 04:19:33 PM »
I would reason, whether it's written or not, that the fulfillment of that card is to avoid the dragon. If your meeple is eaten by the dragon during the game the card says to "show" the card and receive negative 10 points. It is unclear what you do with the card after that. It doesn't call it fulfilled. It doesn't tell you to play on the table in front of you.

The problem with not conisdering the card fulfilled if it is in your hand at game end is that it is then worth negative 10 points because it's in your hand. It negates itself which is of no value. If you lose it during the game you take a penalty, if you hold it at game end you take a bonus. But in either case, what do you do with the card? I would reason that in either case you play it on your table after resolving the affect on your score and count it as fulfilled.

Offline Hounk

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Re: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2015, 06:06:29 AM »
Thanks for your reply. While I'm still in doubt, if this interpretation sticks to the intended rule, we probably will take the "count avoiding the dragon" as a fulfilled order as rule for our game, (if we play with the dragon), because it sure makes sense to do so. Anyway, this seems out of the question:
The problem with not conisdering the card fulfilled if it is in your hand at game end is that it is then worth negative 10 points because it's in your hand.
The rule says:
Quote
This card is different from every other card. [...] As stated above, if a player is still holding the card at the end of the game, they (sic) will not lose 10 points. Instead, they will receive 10 points for avoiding the dragon for the entire time in which they held this card.

Offline Carcking

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Re: Final scoring in "By Order of the King"
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2015, 08:51:29 AM »
... they (sic) will not lose 10 points. Instead, they ...

Not a bad interpretation, and a good way to play. It's a matter of interpretation where and how you apply the "This card is different from every other card." statement. It could be a clarification that the card does not have a particular map dependent layout fulfillment and that's all. That's an opinion though. You still have to imagine what to do with the card after either case is resolved.

I don't know if JPutt has been on lately. Maybe he'll see your post and comment.


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