Author Topic: Tunnel question  (Read 5511 times)

Offline Carcking

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Tunnel question
« on: May 13, 2013, 09:48:48 AM »
Is it allowed to place a tunnel chip on a tunnel opening of a road occupied by another player?

The English translations I've seen say that the tunnel entrance must be "unoccupied". Do you suppose the author was referring to the road connected to the tunnel being unoccupied? Since "occupying" normally refers to the presence of a follower, and tunnel openings cannot be occupied by a follower - Does an "unoccupied tunnel opening" mean one that is connected to an uoccupied road? Or one with no chip on it? Do we consider that a tunnel opening with a chip on it is "occupied"?

Is the word "unoccupied" the correct or best translation from the German? Perhaps "empty", or "unused" or "unclaimed" might be a better fit? I see obervet03 used "unclaimed" in the CAR.

If you use the word "unclaimed" it seem to allow a player to direcly join to another player's road by the placement of the chips. Using the word "unoccupied" could extend to the condition of the road attached and not allow such direct joining.

I wonder if we can get an official confirmation on what the author's intent was. Or is it already out there somewhere?

Linkback: https://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=269.0
I just drew the perfect tile for my MonKnighThieFarmer!

Offline Fritz_Spinne

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2013, 10:38:41 AM »
In german the term is "unbesetzte Tunnelöffnung", so "unoccupied" seems correct.
I think, you can place your tunnel-chip on every tunnel opening, no matter who has claimed the street. But noone would place a tunnel opening to his high-scoring road without placing the tunnel-chip.

Offline Carcking

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2013, 11:12:02 AM »
But noone would place a tunnel opening to his high-scoring road without placing the tunnel-chip.

The risk is that another player can place a tunnel tile on your road and claim the tunnel all in one play. He's not obligated to complete the tunnel so if it's a lake road he could leave you stuck. That would be frustrating for sure.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 12:21:19 PM by Carcking »

Offline obervet

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2013, 12:42:39 PM »
The English translations I've seen say that the tunnel entrance must be "unoccupied".

I think this statement is the key. The rules state that the entrance must be unoccupied/unclaimed/whatever. Followers can't claim or occupy the entrance, they can only claim the road itself. Thus, since the rule only refers to the entrance, I would say that the status of the road itself (occupied or not) really doesn't matter. "Occupied/claimed" simply refers to whether or not a token is on the entrance, and as long as the entrance doesn't have a colored token on it, it's fair game. As I see it, it creates another opportunity to join someone else's road or royally mess them up.

The use of "unclaimed" comes from Matt Harper before me, but I kept it to try to distinguish that term from the occupation of a road by a follower. Maybe the best word would have been "un-tokened", except I don't think that's a real word.  :)

Unfortunately, since Tunnels is a Spielbox expansion, the chances of us getting an official clarification are slim (kind of like the persistently red footnote in the Plague).

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2013, 01:03:14 PM »
I will contact Spielbox - perhaps they like to answer me.
May be Christof Tisch could help.
I personally don't play the tunnels.

Offline Carcking

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2013, 02:10:17 PM »
Yes, that is what I was hoping for - to see if we could get some royal attention  :D

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2013, 06:12:18 AM »
I called today with Barbara Nostheide from Spielbox.
Christwart Conrad is the person for the Carcassonne rules at Spielbox.
I hope we can talk together in the next days.

I have many questions (Tunnel, Plague, Little Buildings).
« Last Edit: May 14, 2013, 06:15:12 AM by kettlefish »

Offline obervet

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2013, 05:15:32 AM »
It's amazing how you guys manage to make the most recent version of the CAR obsolete within days of me getting it online.  :)

Offline Carcking

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2013, 05:57:51 AM »
Haha - that's our goal obervet03 - we don't want you to run out of work  :o

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Tunnel question
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2013, 06:04:31 AM »
I think HiG is working on new things that we all have many new questions in some months ...  ;D
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 06:06:51 AM by kettlefish »


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