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Topics - PapaGeek

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1
Unofficial Rules / Center Scoreboards with River Bonus Features
« on: November 26, 2022, 07:11:28 AM »
We learned about the Bards fan expansion in a recent Carcassonne Central forum thread, and it sparked our interest!

https://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=3008.msg44824#msg44824

Each Bards fan expansion tile allows a player to tag a single feature with a bonus similar to the Inns and Cathedrals expansion, 1 point bonus per tile when the feature is scored, but, the tag has to be placed for the next player.

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Bards_of_Carcassonne_(Fan_Expansion)

Over 60% of all Carcassonne games are played with only two players, so there is a reasonable chance that the tagging player could get the bonus.  In a four player game, the chances will be close to zero!

So, we decided to make up our own house rules for the four or more player games that we play each week.  Since we play with four or more players, we always use one of the Center Scoreboards that we created:

https://www.papageek.com/car/Scoreboard.htm

And we made up our own house rules for creating the Bards bonus features.  We do not use the bards tiles, but we start off each game with a scoreboard with 2, 3, or 4 Rivers, and combine all of the River 1 and River 2 tiles into a random stack.  As each player plays a random river tile, if the tile they are playing does NOT contain a feature on which they can place a meeple, the player is allowed to select any unoccupied feature on the rivers or the center scoreboard and place a 1 point bonus marker on it.  If we are not playing that game with Gold Ingots or Ferries, that is what we use for plus 1 point markers. When a random player selects and plays the River Tile that closed the last river, if that closing tile does not also have the River 2 city feature, they can place another 1 point marker if they want, and then the next player is the first player who can choose to expand one of the 1 point bonus features.

There are 5 standard River 1 and 2 tiles that do not have features on them, plus 4 source and termination river tile without features, and, if house rules allow it, 3 tiles with only a Monastery or Garden in the center of the tile.  When the last river is closed, there will be a random number of river tiles still unplaced, so, depending on that day’s house rules there could be up to 9 or 12 bonus features available for each player as the random normal tile game starts.

Almost all of our games include the Inns and Cathedrals expansion, so having additional features with 1 point bonuses during the game, that are worth zero if unfinished at the end of the game is something we are already used to.   The additional Bards rule that multiple 1 point bonus can be added to the same feature makes the scoring even more interesting!

2
Reviews & Session Reports / Our first Besieger Games
« on: October 31, 2022, 08:00:13 PM »
We just finished our first two Besieger games, and we are totally hooked!

Our game included our Center Scoreboard plus the River, Inns and Cathedrals, Traders and Builders, the standard Fliers plus the Flier fan expansion, and of course the Besiegers.  We played with the RGG Flight rules, but the only time the Flight was used was for a large city where two of the 3 occupants were outnumbered by the third!

It looks like Besiegers will become a standard part for our weekly game nights!

Our special thanks to oldbonz for bringing the Besiegers (Attackers) up to the C2 level!


3
Official Rules / When can I use escaped besieged meeples?
« on: October 29, 2022, 07:58:06 AM »
I have 2 meeples and my builder on a large city where another player has created an impossible to fill 4 sided hole, and we are not playing with the Abbey! There is also a Monastery adjacent to the city.

I draw a besieger tile and add it to the city.  If I understand the RGG rules, I can now remove one of my trapped meeples from the city, then take my builder second turn somewhere else on the board and place a meeple on it, and also remove my second meeple from the besieged city, and since my builder is now alone in the city, I can also return my builder to my stack.

My question deals with the order of events.  Are my meeples (and builder) escaping the city at the start of each turn, or at the end of each turn?  Can I place my escaped meeple, or builder, on another feature in the same turn, or do I have to wait until my next turn to use them again?

4
General / URL Hyperlink coding
« on: October 16, 2022, 02:00:52 PM »
For the sake of discussion I'm going to describe this alternate coding using Curly Brackets instead of Square Brackets.

The normal way to insert a Hyperlink into your forum thread is to click on the second button on the second row (the piece of paper in front of the world globe) and the following coding will appear in your new topic window:

{url}{/url}

Then you insert your desired url between the start and end commands

{url}http://www.papageek.com/car/carcassonne.htm{/url}

This is the link to my personal Carcassonne page: http://www.papageek.com/car/carcassonne.htm

The final result will be your URL underlined on the forum page.  When you click on it, your browser will jump to that page.


All normal, but there is another way to code your link!

Insert your URL inside the end of the first command with an = sign in front of it with the } after it, then insert the words you want to see on your forum post between the }{ Brackets.

{url=http://www.papageek.com/car/carcassonne.htm}My Personal Carcassonne Page{/url}

This is the other way to create a link to My Personal Carcassonne Page

The current Carcassonne Central posting application does not currently make it easy for you to use this alternate coding, but in my opinion, the posts look better.

If you quote this page, you will be able to see the actual coding for my last URL.

5
Official Rules / Escaping a besieged city (Flight)
« on: October 13, 2022, 02:31:30 AM »
The oldbonz post and tile work for the C2 Attackers has generated a huge level of interest with our neighborhood group of 4 players, we can’t wait to play our first game with the new C2 tiles, but we do have one question about the escaping follower.

The rules are clear that you can’t escape a follower from a besieged city and then place that same follower back on the board.  The escape happens and the very end of your turn.

The rules are not clear about placing one of your followers onto the tile you just played, then in the same turn, escape one of your followers from a besieged city, through an adjacent Monastery.

Can you place and then escape in the same turn?

Modified for clarification:

This question is being asked because of the rules for the Abbot.  The rules clearly say that:

“On your turn, if you do not place a meeple during the 2. Placing a meeple phase, you may instead return your already-placed abbot to your supply. If you do so, you score immediately as many points as the garden or monastery your abbot occupied is worth at that time”

The rules for the besieged cities seem to indicate that you can remove your follower even if you did place a meeple, and, even if the rules did not say it, I assume that the escaping follower does NOT score any points!



6
Official Rules / The original rules
« on: October 10, 2022, 11:52:18 PM »
My old link to “The last official printing of the Carcassonne Standard Complete Annotated Rules, S-CAR v7.4” is no longer working! It was created as a 339 page PDF file on May 22, 2015. 

Is there another link available so that I can still look at the original rules?  I’m trying to find the original rules for Besiegers, Cathars, and Siege.

7
General / How many players in your normal Carcassonne games?
« on: October 01, 2022, 09:22:07 PM »
Our neighborhood game night is usually two couples, 4 players, but maybe once a month or so we invite an additional player or couple for 5 or 6 player games.  We have also purchased sets of orange, purple, and brown meeples and phantoms, so we can increase our game size up to 9 if the opportunity presents itself.

Just wondering what the normal game size is for the average player!

8
Unofficial Rules / Center Scoreboard Tiles
« on: September 30, 2022, 08:40:19 PM »
Our personal neighborhood group of 4 players who also invited others to join us for even larger games found that the two players who sit next to the scoreboard at one edge of the table have an advantage over the other players who do not have a good view of the scoreboard.  This is especially true when we are playing with expansions like The Messages or The Robbers.  So we decided to find a way to place the scoreboard in the center of the table so every player has equal visibility and access to the scoreboard.



We have designed 5 different versions of the scoreboard so far and we have designed a webpage to help others to print their own copies of the scoreboards.  There are also two additional page links at the bottom of the page for anyone who want to design and print their own personal center scoreboards.

http://www.papageek.com/car/Scoreboard.htm

This is the link to the first page for downloading our current scoreboards, we would appreciate your opinion on having the scoreboard in the center of the table when there are more than two players and also your opinion on letting others design and print their own personal versions.


9
Unofficial Rules / Can the Robbers Son place a Phantom
« on: August 11, 2022, 02:03:30 AM »
We recently found an interesting fan expansion called the Robber's Son.

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Robber%27s_Son_(Fan_Expansion)

The rules are clear that if you do use the tile to remove a highwayman from a road, you cannot then place your own meeple on the tile.

There is not a rule section for the interaction with other expansion.  How does everyone feel about a rule expansion stating that when you do remove a highwayman, you are still allowed to place your Phantom (and only your Phantom) on the Robber's Son Tile?

Another thought on this, if we are also playing with The Robbers Expansion, why not let the Robber’s Son add two more robbers to the scorecard! This would happen at the end of the turn, after the scoring phase.

10
Official Rules / The Robber insta-rogue points
« on: July 28, 2022, 06:35:07 AM »
The WikiCarPedia page for The Robbers is not specific on normal meeple placement.

1.   Draw a tile with a Robber logo.

2.   Place or move your personal Robber on the scoreboard next to another player’s scoring figure. (You cannot place it on your own scoring figure).

3.   Going around the board in order, the next player who’s Robber is not on the scoreboard yet places their Robber on the scoreboard. (This happens only one time, not once for each player).

The “Placing a meeple” section of the Wiki page only says “The figures in this expansion are not placed on the standard land tiles as part of the game.”  It does not say that you can also place a normal meeple and/or Phantom on the robber land tile.

It then goes into “Scoring a feature”, again only talks about how the Robber is scored.

I have two questions:

1.   I assume that after placing up to two Robbers on the scorecard, you can then place your normal meeple and or Phantom on the Robber Tile. Is that correct?

2.   Also, if the placement of the Robber Tile also completes a feature for another player, since the Robber placement happens in phase 2 of your turn and feature scoring happens in phase 3, are you allowed to place your Robber on that player’s scoring figure so that you can immediately receive your rogue points?

11
Official Rules / Wagon and Builder
« on: July 01, 2022, 12:10:05 AM »
You can place your wagon on a tile just like placing a meeple, and it does count as a single meeple for scoring and control of the feature.

Builders can be added to features that you control, but I don’t see anything on WikiCarPedia that specifically says that you can add your builder to your wagon controlled feature and then get builder second turns.

Is this legal?

12
Official Rules / Tower, Builder, Phantom combo
« on: June 03, 2022, 07:49:08 PM »
Would this be a legal move?

I draw a CCRR tile which I can add to the City that contains my Builder.  The tile also completes an unoccupied road. Two of my opponents are also building a large shared city on a different location on the map.

I do not place my meeple on the newly completed road, instead a place a Tower Floor on a tower base that is next to shared large city and capture one of my opponent’s meeples. Then I place my Phantom on the completed road to score an instant 3 points and get my Phantom back.

Now for my Builder Second Turn:
I am lucky and draw a tile that will complete what was the large shared city at the start of my turn.  Instead of placing the second turn meeple, I place another Tower Floor on the tower base and capture the second opponent’s meeple from the large city. Finally I place my Phantom (which I just got back) on the new tile to capture the large city for myself. Then, in the second turn scoring phase, I score the large city and get my Phantom back.

This sounds too good to be true, but I think it does follow all of the rules!

13
Official Rules / Can a Tower Floor capture more than one meeple?
« on: May 25, 2022, 09:06:32 AM »
When you are playing with The Tower AND The Flier expansions, it is possible that the tile that you choose to attack after placing your tower floor could have more than one meeple on it.

Do you capture all of the meeples on the tile you choose, or do you have to select which meeple you are going to capture?

PS: to the admins: The “Other expansions” section of the WikiCarPedia page does not mention The Flier (Flying Machines)!

14
Official Rules / Tower: 3 way prisoner exchange
« on: May 25, 2022, 12:48:09 AM »
If red has captured a blue meeple, then if blue captures a red meeple, the prisoner exchange is automatic.

But what would happens if?

Red captured a blue meeple, then green captures a red meeple: what happens when blue captures a green meeple?  Can all 3 players agree on a 3 way prisoner exchange?  Or does each player have to wait for their turn to do individual buy backs?

The rules say that the 2 way exchange is automatic!  Is the 3 way exchange also automatic?

15
Strategy Guide / Next Move Strategy
« on: May 06, 2022, 10:23:48 AM »
When our group introduces new players to the game, one of the first things we talk about is the Next Move Strategy!

Each turn in Carcassonne is divided into 3 phases: 1. Draw and Place a tile, 2. Place a meeple and 3. Score a feature. When you start playing Carcassonne your primary objective with each New Tile is how you can score the most points with it - how to maximize your point scoring. As you continue to play Carcassonne, you start to develop strategies for how to maximize your points while minimizing your opponent's points! Eventually, you start to think about your Next Move, then you start thinking about your opponent's Next Move!

The Next Move Strategy

A large part of the Next Move Strategy is understanding what tile could be drawn for making that Next Move.

Memorizing the lists of what tiles are included in every expansion of the Carcassonne game and then combining those lists to know what tiles are available in the current game you are playing is nearly impossible except for the real experts who have played thousands of games.

So, if the Next Move Strategy doesn't depend on that level of understanding, what does it depend on?

Your Next Move and your opponents Next Move will be more difficult if the Next Move Tile has to match 2 sides instead just 1, 3 sides instead of just 2, and 4 sides instead of just 3 makes it extremely difficult!

If the first player in a new basic game extends the road with a RFRF tile and the second player draws a CCFF tile, how should they place their tile? What does the Next Move have to do with it?


Placing this tile as shown in the first example will require your Next Move tile to match the existing board on two sides while placing the same tile as shown in the second example will only require your Next Move tile to match the existing board on only one side. 44 of the 72 Basic Game Tiles have a city on at least one side while only 25 tiles have a city on one side with a field on an adjacent side. But you don't have to know the exact numbers to know what your best move is!

The odds of randomly picking a tile that you need is considerably reduced by the number of sides that your tile has to match!
 
OK, you chose the best placement of your tile for your game, but your opponent also knows about the Next Move Strategy, so when they draw their RRFF next tile, what should they do?

Do they place their tile to reduce the chances of another player completing their feature, or place their tile to complete or extend one of their own features, or, is there a way of doing both at the same time?


Yes, both placements of your RRFF tile as shown will cause your opponent to match 2 sides instead of one on their Next Move, but... The one on the right leaves you needing only a 1 sided match for your Road -?- but the one on the left might also force your opponent to help you extend your Road! Ever wonder why the more games you play, the longer it takes you to make your Next Move?

The expansion of your Next Move Strategy is the primary way that you become a better and better Carcassonne player. As you grow in the game you start looking at the Next Next Move, etc.

And, there is also an extremely important reason for expanding your implementation of this strategy, when you limit your opponent's opportunities to complete their features, you are also trapping their meeples on the board, hopefully for the rest of the game!

The very first topic in The Book of Carcassonne, Chapter 8: Advanced Strategy; is "The Art of the Trap", how to trap your opponents meeples on the board! It talks about Digging Holes, how to create 4 sided empty spaces that are impossible or at least nearly impossible to fill, and using these holes to trap your opponent’s meeples on the board. It then talks about the situations when you should or should not consider digging holes, and of course, some of the strategies used to defend against having your meeples trapped.

One final thought that is extremely important: If you don't win, learn. Sometimes the tiles are against you; this is an opportunity to analyze the game you just lost and learn something from it.




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