Jousting Tournament
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Author Topic: Jousting Tournament  (Read 7060 times)
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Joff
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« on: October 09, 2008, 12:49:45 pm »

Here is the first draft of my new CC mini-expansion, Jousting Tournament. Please take a look and give me some feedback. The rules are in a state of 'flux' at the moment. It needs your input. There is an extra tile that is used in this mini-expansion:


As I said, this is only the first draft but here is the pdf of the rules: Draft Rules

...and the tile (although it does appear above): Jousting Ring Tile

Thanks.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2008, 02:42:52 pm by Joff » Logged
Scott
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« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2008, 06:24:54 pm »

Well done. A famous medieval sport is added to a medieval game.

Am I correct in my conclusion that the jousting champion meeple remains on the tile for the rest of the game?

As for the artwork, I would recommend some sort of sitting area for the guests of honor who preside over such activities. (Think of the movie A Knight's Tale.)
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Novelty
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« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2008, 07:42:24 pm »

You are welcome! Smiley

I have no idea where you got the ring from, but the shadown in front makes it seems as if it's floating... at least to me... but that's a minor point.

Scott, the jousting champion is removed once the city is scored, but may remain on the tile until the end of the game if the city is not scored.

Joff, I have concerns that this tile will allow a city to be scored twice for the same playing, thus giving that player a large and unassailable lead.  No other feature can probably come close.  Perhaps the jousting champion should be determined some other way (last person to complete another city perhaps?) instead of using the majority in the city.

Oh andI like the Carc Central ad at the end of the rules.  Scott, could you perhaps put that into Gold Mines and Forests as well please? Thanks!

Edit: Joff, why just one tile?  Why not one per player (like the Abbey tile)?
« Last Edit: October 09, 2008, 07:47:06 pm by Novelty » Logged

Joff
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« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2008, 09:50:00 am »

SCORING THE JOUSTING CHAMPION

The idea of scoring the city twice encourages others to compete to become the jousting champion. The points are meant to reflect the prestige associated with taking this title. Of course, this could mean that the jousting champion may score for both the tournament and the city, something which could well be undesirable. I see the problem associated with this (even more so if it is a Cathedral city where, if completed, could mean the player scoring a minimum total of 56 points!).

To counter this I propose three options:

Option 1: A player who has majority Knight occupancy in the city hosting the tournament is declared jousting champion. This player scores for the jousting champion and then removes all his presence from the city.

Option 2: A player who has majority Knight occupancy in the city hosting the tournament is declared jousting champion. This player scores for the jousting champion and then removes all his Knight presence from the city.

Option 3: A player who has majority occupancy in the city hosting the tournament is declared jousting champion. This player scores for the jousting champion and then removes all his presence from the city along with everyone else. The city being scored only once.

The first option gives the jousting champion no extra opportunity for scoring the city twice.

The second option gives the jousting champion another opportunity for scoring the city, but he is now limited by having to remove his Knights from inside the city walls.

The third option only scores for the city once for all.


ONLY ONE TILE?

The reason for not giving all players a jousting ring tile is simply because there is only one tournament annually in one city only. The opportunity for gaining from this tournament is meant to be once per game only. I have another idea in the pipeline which might add more than one tile, but that’s for another thread.
 

SHOULD THE MAYOR SCORE A BONUS?

At present (in the draft rules) any Mayor occupying a completed jousting city (as long as there is a champion) scores an extra 5 points as a bonus for hosting the jousting tournament.

I propose three options:

Option 1: There is no other bonus for a Mayor occupying the city.

Option 2: Any Mayor gets a bonus of 5 points (as is per draft rules).

Option 3: Any Mayor gets a bonus of 5 points, except the player who is the jousting champion.


EQUAL MAJORITY SCORING

At present the draft rules are supposed to reflect that there can only be one jousting champion (I’m not sure if they explain this very well at the moment). If another player gains a majority over the current jousting champion becomes the new champion, equalling will not do (similar to the way King and Robber Baron works). But should this be changed to have an equal majority scoring in the case of a draw?
Personally, I don’t like this idea and prefer to have an outright jousting champion. But how to work it?


THE CARCASSONNE CENTRAL LOGO

The logo for CC is intentional. You will also notice that under the mini-expansion title is the sentence ‘A Carcassonne Central mini-expansion by Jonathan Warren’. Both the logo and the statement are meant to reflect that I am ‘working’ as an author for CC. I would like to keep producing quality Carcassonne additions to assist in expanding this community. I would rather have variants/expansions (formatted in the same or similar style) hosted at CC, thus maintaining a single look and a single source for these variants/expansions.
 

Again, your thoughts to make this mini-expansion workable would be much appreciated Smiley
« Last Edit: October 10, 2008, 04:28:12 pm by Joff » Logged
Novelty
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« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2008, 10:08:33 am »

I like these options... if we are voting...

Option 1: A player who has majority Knight occupancy in the city hosting the tournament is declared jousting champion. This player scores for the jousting champion and then removes all his presence from the city.

Option 3: Any Mayor gets a bonus of 5 points, except the player who is the jousting champion.

With regards to equal majority, perhaps nobody should get points because it's a draw/tie.  Or perhaps wagons and mayors  (if any) decides the winner?  Perhaps maybe the person holding the King token?  How are jousts settled if there's no clear winner?
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Joff
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« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2008, 10:26:40 am »

With regards to equal majority, perhaps nobody should get points because it's a draw/tie.  Or perhaps wagons and mayors  (if any) decides the winner?  Perhaps maybe the person holding the King token?  How are jousts settled if there's no clear winner?

Exactly. Should there be a draw? How should jousts be settled if there is no clear winner (if one should allow equal sharing)?

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Novelty
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« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2008, 10:29:34 am »

I mean, how are jousts settle in real life, if there's no clear winner?  I presume there are still people doing "reconstructions" and stuff...
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Scott
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« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2008, 10:35:44 am »

As I recall, they joust up to three times (basically using up their lances) and if no winner can be determined from the joust, they battle it out on the ground with swords.

Another scoring option could be a fixed amount of points, since in a real tournament, the prize is the same regardless of where it's held.

I will add the same CarcCentral branding to the Forest and Gold Mines expansions. That will help steer people back to here in the event that somebody uploads our PDF files somewhere else.
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Novelty
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« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2008, 12:17:50 pm »

Joff, just a suggestion: could you incorporate scoring examples and perhaps the "switching of champion" into the rules document?  They'll probably be draft, but at least it'll make it easier to understand the descriptive part of the rules.
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Joff
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« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2008, 12:53:15 pm »

I plan to release a 2nd draft over the weekend. I've made up a tile for testing purposes and will show some examples in the next release. However, i'm not sure if switching is actually needed should I go with the largest Knight majority and then removing all occupiers from city once complete. This is the side i'm leaning to at the moment...
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Joff
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« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2008, 06:01:33 pm »

Ok, 2nd Draft is up.

2nd Draft
« Last Edit: October 10, 2008, 06:03:23 pm by Joff » Logged
Novelty
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« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2008, 09:43:49 pm »

Nicely done.  Thanks for the scoring examples.  I think it makes things a lot clearer.
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Joff
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« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2008, 03:16:27 am »

A slightly new tile design for a new draft:

As for the artwork, I would recommend some sort of sitting area for the guests of honor who preside over such activities. (Think of the movie A Knight's Tale.)

I'm not a very good computer artist Sad

I have no idea where you got the ring from, but the shadown in front makes it seems as if it's floating... at least to me... but that's a minor point.

Where did I get the ring from? Simple! Have a look at the Siege tiles... all elements were 'stolen' from these! It was all done in a photo editing program. The ring itself was constructed by individually placing the stakes surrounding an oval of green! Shadow has been removed. Is that better?

I hav also enlarged the houses in the city. They were printing out too small.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2008, 03:54:53 am by Joff » Logged
Novelty
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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2008, 03:19:52 am »

I like that a lot better.  Now do me a favour... get the blur tool, set it to about 10% and make a quick pass at the bottom edge of the stakes (only the outside) twice (make sure you do not select the background).  That should make them less stark and blend in more to make them seem as if they are actually planted into the ground.
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wellidesigns
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« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2008, 03:30:39 am »

this looks fabulous. love the tile much better than the previous one !
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plays with all official expansions + Gold Mines,Jousting tournament, Lavendar fields, Forests (partial), The orders of Chivalry, In the stocks, The gallows, archery tournament, the outpost, apothecaries and tithes, wells, wheatfields, grim reaple, Market commons and a lot of other german expansions.
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