Author Topic: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis  (Read 6728 times)

Offline kettlefish

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Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« on: February 18, 2013, 02:01:46 PM »
obervet03 gave me some interesting questions.
I have already some answers, because some parts I became the answers from Georg Wild some time ago and some answers are the rules itself.

Question 1:
Q: Can the mayor be a flier?
A:Yes the mayor is a follower and can fly, but the mayor can only land on a not finished city. If there is not an unfinished city then the turn is over and the mayor goes back to the players supply.
The answer gave me Georg Wild at one of our xxxx calls.

one of my questions to Georg Wild
Q: Can the mayor also go through the magic portal?
A:Yes the mayor is a follower and can go through the magic portal, but the mayor can only be placed on a not finished and unclimed city.

Information from Georg Wild - 14 02 2013:
The player scores 0 Points for a finished city without any pennants and with the mayor in it.
The mayor can only be placed in a city not in a castle.
(This sentence is difficult to the rule from the BigBox3.)

Linkback: http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=98.0
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 03:45:30 PM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2013, 02:23:52 PM »
Question 2:
Q: Can a flier land on a magic portal?
A: No, the flier can only land on an unfinished road, city or an unfinished cloister. A magic portal is an other feature.

Q: Is a magic portal ever considered completed?
A: The magic portal is a separate feature, that is a portal... The follower can only go through the portal and not build something on the magic portal, but only one follower can go through it.

If you play with the phantom as a second follower and the first (wooden) follower goes through the magic portal (the first follower claimed the magic portal) then the phantom can't go through the magic portal.
Answer from Georg Wild - 14 02 2013.


« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 03:44:16 PM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2013, 01:45:24 PM »
Question 3:
What are the actual rules for the Wheel of Fortune Famine sector? A previous clarification said that the
statement “in the same way as farms are scored at final scoring” means that a majority of farmers is required.
However, it seems like this is the opposite of the Tax sector, where a majority is NOT required to get the
points for knights. Plus, the rule says that the player scores “for each of his FARMERS,” not each farm. It
seems like each farmer should score points, and that the “end of game” comment should mean that bonuses are
given for pigs, castles, etc. (NOT that a majority is required).

I have to say, that I don't know the answer.
I think we have some answers at the HiG-Chat or at Spielbox-forum. I have to look.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2013, 02:53:30 PM »
Question 4:
.In the Ferries, I have interpreted that a ferry can only be moved if a new tile is placed and the wooden ferry itself is a part of that road (and the first ferry along that road).
In other words, if the road that was just extended ends at the lake, and the ferry piece is connecting two of the OTHER segments, the ferry CANNOT be moved.
Is this correct?
Or can the ferry be moved when ANY of the road segments on that lake are extended?


Here are some links to BGG:

Reply Chrstiof Tisch - The Babarian Report from Whaleyland about the ferries:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/11071158#11071158

Christof Tisch - new examples for the ferries:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/1537687/carcassonne-the-ferries?size=medium

Christof Tisch makes the graphics and the design of the rules for Carcassonne also he is creating some of the meeples. His answers are official.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2013, 01:10:55 AM by kettlefish »

Offline Carcking

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2013, 06:41:54 PM »
Unfortunately, Christof Tisch's answer does not answer obervet03's question, nor was he asked that question in the BGG post. It's too bad his illustrated examples also don't answer the question. Coincidentally, or not, they only show nearest ferries that are already situated on the the road that is being extended.

The question restated is - if I place a tile that extends a road connected to a ferry tile where the ferry is not connected to that road, but rather to two other roads on the ferry tile, do I still get to move the ferry?
I just drew the perfect tile for my MonKnighThieFarmer!

Offline Fritz_Spinne

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2013, 11:01:34 PM »
Question 4 - the answer:
In the rules the term ferry is used only for the wooden ferry, not for the tile itself, they are called tile with a lake. So a road connecting to a ferry is a road connecting to a lake-tile with the ferry connecting that road with another road of the lake. So you cannot move a ferry if you extend a road from the lake without connecting the ferry on that tile with a lake.

From the rules:

Straße mit Fähren verlängern und Fährrouten ändern – Legt der Spieler seine Landschaftskarte an eine Straße an, die eine Fähre als Teil hat, darf er diese Fähre nun umlegen. (German Mini 3)

Continuing a road with a ferry – If, by placing a tile, a player continues a road where there is a ferry, that player may move the ferry. (BigBox4 ZMan)
« Last Edit: February 20, 2013, 01:10:03 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2013, 01:08:35 AM »
Thanks Fritz_Spinne,
my cat decided yesterday to sleep at my keyboard, so I can't answer anymore.
------------------------------------------
Carcking,
The examples from Christof Tisch also the reply from him at BGG (they are not the answer for the question from obervet03 - I don't marked them in my green)
I think the examples belonges to the CAR. If you like as a big footnote.
--------------------------------------------
 BLUE - question
GREEN - answer
BLACK - all the rest - information, comments....

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2013, 09:44:00 PM »
Question 5 - part 1:
When playing with the Robbers, what happens if multiple features are completed at the same time?

CAR 6.2 - page 138
other rules:
• If a robber is on the same space as several counting followers, and more than one of these followers scores points on the same turn, the owner of the robber can choose which counting follower’s points to gets half of.



« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 09:45:41 PM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2013, 10:51:54 PM »
Question 5 - part 2:
The way it is currently written in the CAR Order of Play (and similar to the way the Messages are played), each feature is scored individually, and the active player gets to choose which feature is scored first.
Thus, the active player could choose to score the highest-value feature first (if it’s his own robber that will be getting points) or the lowest-value feature first (if an opponent’s robber will be getting points), so the robber only gets half the points of ONE feature.
Is this correct, or does the robber get half of the points of ALL features scored on that turn (that belong to the appropriate counting follower)?


CAR 6.2 – page 151
Order of Play
Step 6:
c) The current player chooses the order in which the features resolve.
This is wrong by playing with the robbers. The owner of the robber chooses which counting follower’s points his robber is robbing a half.


CAR 6.2 – page 152
Step 6E:
b) If playing with the Robbers expansion, check to see if a robber is next to the
counting follower that is about to be moved for scoring, and resolve all “Robber Points”.
If playing with the Robbers expansion, check to see if a robber is next to the counting followers they are about to be moved for scoring, and resolve the “Robber Points” for one of the scoring points that the owner of the robber can choose.

The robber can only resolve the "robber points" from one of the counting followers. But the owner of the robber can choose which points from the counting followers the robber is robbing.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2013, 11:34:48 PM »
Question 3:
What are the actual rules for the Wheel of Fortune Famine sector? A previous clarification said that the statement “in the same way as farms are scored at final scoring” means that a majority of farmers is required.
However, it seems like this is the opposite of the Tax sector, where a majority is NOT required to get the points for knights. Plus, the rule says that the player scores “for each of his FARMERS,” not each farm. It seems like each farmer should score points, and that the “end of game” comment should mean that bonuses are given for pigs, castles, etc. (NOT that a majority is required).

I have to say, that I don't know the answer.
I think we have some answers at the HiG-Chat or at Spielbox-forum. I have to look.

CAR 6.2 - page 90
Famine
For each of his or her farmers, every player receives 1 point for every
completed city adjacent to the farm (in the same way as farms are
scored during final scoring)


The German rule:
HUNGERSNOT
Jeder Spieler bekommt für jeden seiner Bauern 1 Punkt pro fertiger Stadt, die an dessen Wiese grenzt bzw. in dessen Wiese liegt (in gleicher Weise wie bei der Bauernwertung am Schluss, siehe Seite 6 + 7).


The German rule says "an/in dessen Wiese" - that means you have to look to whom the farm belonges. That means the normal "farmer scoring" - you have to look for the majority.
----------------------------------------------------

This is the correction of the rule:
CAR 6.2 - page 90
Famine
For each of his or her farmers, every player receives 1 point for every
completed city adjacent to his/her own farm (in the same way as farms are
scored during final scoring)


CAR 6.2 - page 90 - footnote 291
now, we have no differences between inside or outside the parentheses.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2013, 11:53:50 PM by kettlefish »

Offline obervet

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2013, 08:09:08 AM »
Question 5 - part 1:
When playing with the Robbers, what happens if multiple features are completed at the same time?

CAR 6.2 - page 138
other rules:
• If a robber is on the same space as several counting followers, and more than one of these followers scores points on the same turn, the owner of the robber can choose which counting follower’s points to gets half of.


The rule talks about 1 robber on a space with multiple counting followers that score. What if, though, the same player (a single counting follower) is getting points from more than one feature, such as a city and a road that were completed at the same time? Does the robber get half of the TOTAL points? Or does the robber get half of the points from ONE feature? And if it's only one feature, does the robber player still get to choose?

Offline obervet

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2013, 08:19:53 AM »
The German rule says "an/in dessen Wiese" - that means you have to look to whom the farm belonges. That means the normal "farmer scoring" - you have to look for the majority.

I suppose I can live with this, although I have to admit that I don't really like it. It doesn't make sense that you get points for farms that you control (like at the end of the game), but each farmer gets to score individually (which is not like the end of the game). I think I'd be happier if the Tax sector worked the same way, but it seems confusing that one sector gives an award to all appropriate followers and the other only gives the award to followers in a majority.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2013, 08:43:51 AM »
Question 5 - part 1:
When playing with the Robbers, what happens if multiple features are completed at the same time?

CAR 6.2 - page 138
other rules:
• If a robber is on the same space as several counting followers, and more than one of these followers scores points on the same turn, the owner of the robber can choose which counting follower’s points to gets half of.


The rule talks about 1 robber on a space with multiple counting followers that score. What if, though, the same player (a single counting follower) is getting points from more than one feature, such as a city and a road that were completed at the same time? Does the robber get half of the TOTAL points? Or does the robber get half of the points from ONE feature? And if it's only one feature, does the robber player still get to choose?
Each feature scores separated. The robber gets the half of the points for one of the features for scoring.

We have also this rule:
CAR 6.2 page 138
• A robber must always take the first allowable points awarded (i.e. other than “rogue points”). He may not wait for a larger score later.

« Last Edit: February 26, 2013, 09:05:27 AM by kettlefish »

Offline Carcking

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2013, 10:10:28 AM »
Each feature scores separated. The robber gets the half of the points for one of the features for scoring.

IMO - Logic would dictate that the Robber can choose which feature to rob - just as he would if there were two players scoring from the same space. One may score a city and one may score a road as a result of the same tile being placed that completes two features at once - the Robber can choose which to rob - he is not only chosing a player to rob but technically, which feature score to rob.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2013, 10:30:48 AM by Carcking »

Offline obervet

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Re: Some Questions from obervet03 and my Answers about the Minis
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2013, 10:56:33 AM »
Each feature scores separated. The robber gets the half of the points for one of the features for scoring.

IMO - Logic would dictate that the Robber can choose which feature to rob - just as he would if there were two players scoring from the same space. One may score a city and one may score a road as a result of the same tile being placed that completes two features at once - the Robber can choose which to rob - he is not only chosing a player to rob but technically, which feature score to rob.

I agree with this way of thinking about it -- the robber gets to make the call if there's a choice to be made. I'll just have to adjust the Order of Play to reflect that. Unless Skull One is out there to help....


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