Author Topic: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)  (Read 340 times)

Offline qwe45

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JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« on: January 12, 2021, 07:22:12 PM »
Hello everyone!
I have been a lurker for a while, but have just popped up to ask a question.

farin's JCloisterZone currently implements that if you close a field with your shepherd, you grow the flock automatically before the automatic guide the flock.  Is this correct according to the rules?



Linkback: http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=4981.0
« Last Edit: January 12, 2021, 08:06:53 PM by qwe45, Reason: misunderstanding. »

Offline Carcassonne93

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2021, 07:38:30 PM »
"Exception: If any player completes a field with shepherds and sheep by fully surrounding it by roads and cities, immediately resolve the Guide the flock to the stable action for that field." https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Hills_%26_Sheep#1._Placing_a_tile.

Offline qwe45

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring times(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2021, 07:56:49 PM »
"Exception: If any player completes a field with shepherds and sheep by fully surrounding it by roads and cities, immediately resolve the Guide the flock to the stable action for that field." https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Hills_%26_Sheep#1._Placing_a_tile.


I want to ask the question again.
If you close your own shepherd's field do you
A: Automatically scoring the flock without growing it.
B: Grow the flock automatically and then scoring the flock since the field has been closed.
C: Choose between scoring the flock now or grow the flock and then scoring since the field has been closed.
D: Other options
?

I think the answer is C.

Offline Willem

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2021, 11:53:41 PM »
It is indeed C.
When a field with a shepherd is closed, it automatically scores for the sheep. Both sheep and shepherd are removed from that field.
If you close the field your own shepherd is in, you can choose to grow the flock, or score it, but even if you grow it, it is scored directly after.

Think of it as placing a shepherd in a CCCC tile with field in the middle. You would then place the shepherd, grow the flock and score the flock all in the same turn.
To be or not to:
A.  B
B.  C
C.  P

Offline Bumsakalaka

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2021, 12:25:52 AM »
As I wrote on github. Rule for grow flocks from closed field is directive, not optional.
So I read it.

When somebody closes field with at least one shepherd, shephers on this field are automatic scoring and this step part is not counted to current player step.

Offline Meepledrone

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2021, 12:31:10 AM »
Yep, option C is the right one. Please check the example for the exception here (Example 3).

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Hills_%26_Sheep#1._Placing_a_tile

You can see that you expand your flock first and then your shepherd is scored right away.

I gave Farin a heads-up on Slack just in case.
Questions about rules? Check WICA: wikicarpedia.com

Offline Willem

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2021, 12:32:51 AM »
As I wrote on github. Rule for grow flocks from closed field is directive, not optional.
So I read it.

When somebody closes field with at least one shepherd, shephers on this field are automatic scoring and this step part is not counted to current player step.
If someone e
Closes a field with someone else's shepherd in it, that is correct; that shepherd is automatically scored, without the player choosing to do so or not.
However if you close a field with your own shepherd, you have the option to expand, as you always have when you extend the field your shepherd is in

Offline Bumsakalaka

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2021, 01:26:10 AM »
Yep, option C is the right one. Please check the example for the exception here (Example 3).

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Hills_%26_Sheep#1._Placing_a_tile

You can see that you expand your flock first and then your shepherd is scored right away.

I gave Farin a heads-up on Slack just in case.

Please I'm checking Example 3 on WiCa
Example 3: You place a tile and grow your flock. Since you have completely closed the field with your shepherd with this tile, you immediately guide the flock to the stable and score 7 points.

So steps:
1. Placed tile which enlarge and close fields with shepherd of current player.
2. What happends here?
a) Player choose to : Grow the flock - and taken is not wolf
by example 3 sheeps are guided to the stable => means automatically get's points
b) Player choose to : Guide the flock to the stable (no question here)

another situation

1. Placed tile which enlarge and close fields without shepherd of current player.
2. What happends here?
Are the flock automaticly guided to players with shephers on currently closed field?

Offline Meepledrone

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Re: JCloisterZone Shepherd field closed scoring(Hills & Sheep)
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2021, 11:59:37 AM »
Yep, option C is the right one. Please check the example for the exception here (Example 3).

https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/Hills_%26_Sheep#1._Placing_a_tile

You can see that you expand your flock first and then your shepherd is scored right away.

I gave Farin a heads-up on Slack just in case.

Please I'm checking Example 3 on WiCa
Example 3: You place a tile and grow your flock. Since you have completely closed the field with your shepherd with this tile, you immediately guide the flock to the stable and score 7 points.

So steps:
1. Placed tile which enlarge and close fields with shepherd of current player.
2. What happends here?
a) Player choose to : Grow the flock - and taken is not wolf
by example 3 sheeps are guided to the stable => means automatically get's points
b) Player choose to : Guide the flock to the stable (no question here)

Correct. These are the options that may happen to you when expanding a field with your shepherd:  :(y)
1. You decide to Guide the flock to the stable: you do not push you luck and score right away.
2. You decide to Grow the flock: you push your lack one more time:
   - If you draw a sheep token, you add it to your flock and score it right away.
   - If you draw a wolf token, you score no points

In any case you remove your shepherd and return your sheep tokens to the bag. If you drew a wolf token, you return it to the bag too.

another situation

1. Placed tile which enlarge and close fields without shepherd of current player.
2. What happends here?
Are the flock automaticly guided to players with shepherds on currently closed field?

When a field is closed, all the shepherds in it are scored, no matter the owner. In practical terms, the only difference is that if you are the active player and your shepherd is in the closed field, you have the option to draw a sheep token before scoring all the shepherds. You will be able to scratch up to 4 more points if you are lucky, but you can also lose all the points for your flock. It's up to you.  ;)


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