Author Topic: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015  (Read 45908 times)

Offline kettlefish

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Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« on: October 12, 2015, 09:23:21 PM »
I've got some answers from HiG (Georg Wild) at Spiel 2015 - 08 10 2015:

Question in BLUE

Answer in GREEN

Still open in RED

My own comments in  MAROON

Obervet gave me the questions in October 2015 by PM - this time 14 questions

Linkback: http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2125.0

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2015, 09:39:37 PM »
1. Does a Halfling gap prevent spread of the Plague in that direction? (Probably not, as a lone Halfling seems to have full-tile status.)
No, a Halfling gabe does not prevent spread of the Plague.
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2. Can a barn be placed if one (or more) of the tiles at the intersection of corners are Halfling tiles?
Yes, a barn can be placed as long as 4 tiles touch at the intersection, even if there is one or more halfling tiles.

I will post some example pictures later.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2015, 12:20:55 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2015, 10:15:50 PM »
3. Do the German castles protect followers from the Dragon the same way that other castles do?
No - the German Castle doesn't protect followers from the Dragon. The German Castle has more a function like a cloister - it is on one tile, than less the function like a castle, which is between 2 tiles.
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4. Does a German castle count for farm scoring?
No, it doesn't count for farm scoring - see the explaination at 3.
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5. When the Dragon lands on a German castle tile (the double tile), does this whole tile count as a single tile for the purposes of movement?
The German castle tile is one single tile - so the dragon needs only one of his 6 moves for this tile and then he has more opportunities to continue his way.

The dragon is like a person in my opinion  - so I don't use "it" and "its" - I use "he" and "his".
« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 02:20:26 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2015, 10:39:13 PM »
6a. Does a German castle count as 1 tile or 2 for the purposes of moving a flier?
The German castle count as 1 tile. If the flier lands on this tile, than the flier has the choice of 3 roads, 1 city or the German Castle (the function or the mechanics of the German Castle is more like a cloister). The flier can only land on one of these features if it is not finished yet.
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6b. If the flier is moving diagonally, does it move in a straight line, or does it enter via one corner and exit via the far opposite corner?
The flight of the flier is diagonally in a straight line in that direction what the arrow shows from the fliying machine. The angle of the arrow doesn't change. It would change the angle to enter via one corner and exit via the far opposite corner  - and that is not the angle of the direction of the arrow from the flying machine symbol. If the flier lands on the German castle tile - then the flier has the choice of 3 roads, 1 city or the German Castle. The flier can only land on one of these features if it is not finished yet.


the picture with the German castle tile and the finished roads:
- The score for the road at the top of the German castle tile: 3 points + 3 bonus points for the involved German castle tile = total 6 points
- The score for the road at the bottom of the German castle tile: 2 points + 3 bonus points for the involved German castle tile = total 5 points
« Last Edit: October 19, 2015, 10:46:52 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2015, 11:26:16 PM »
7. Does a German castle count as 1 tile or 2 for the purposes of tower kidnap range?
The German castle count as 1 tile for the range of the tower.
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8. Does a German castle tile count as only 1 tile for placing Plague tokens?
Yes, the German castle count as 1 tile for the plague tokens.
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I need a rest - more will follow...
« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 01:29:40 AM by kettlefish »

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2015, 01:45:10 AM »
Thanks kettlefish!

Rest well :)

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #6 on: October 13, 2015, 11:40:06 AM »
9. Does a German castle’s long edge count as 2 tiles for the purposes of barn placement? In other words, is the midpoint of a long edge counted as a corner that only needs 2 other tiles placed in order to build a barn?
This question is not yet resolved. Georg Wild and I had different opinions about it. So technically there are no 4  corners - the result of my opinion is NO. Gerorg Wild knows that, but he "feels" that the result will more a YES. So we will talk about it again.

the following 3rd picture shows my opinion of the situation with barn and German castle tile and triangle tiles.(Oct.2015)
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The question is now resolved with Georg Wild (HiG) and me. Here comes the result.(April 2016)

See the 1st picture which shows the possible and not possible placements for the barn if the German Castle tile with its long edge and triangle tiles are part of the landscape.

See the 2nd picture which shows some possible and not possible placements for the barn if the German Castle tile with its small edge and triangle tiles are part of the landscape.

The base ground for the barn has to be stable - that means in the middle all tiles have to touch each other - no quarter is empty in the middle - all tiles have farm in the middle for the placement of the barn.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2016, 08:11:41 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2015, 11:48:50 AM »
10. Does a German castle count as 2 tiles for the purposes of scoring a cloister?
No, the German castle tile is one tile and counts as one tile for scoring a cloister

with the answer of this question cloister and German castle tile - I then asked again HiG - Georg Wild about the triangle (halfling) tiles.
more about if follows in a new posting.
Here is the link to that posting:
http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2125.msg29727#msg29727

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12a. Can a wagon be placed on a German castle?
Yes, the wagon can be placed on a German castle.
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12b. Can a wagon drive to a German castle after completing a road that is connected to the German castle?
Yes, a wagon can drive to a German castle after completing a road that is connected to the German castle - as long as the German castle is not finished and no other follower owns it.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 07:21:43 AM by kettlefish »

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2015, 11:52:11 AM »
11. Is the inn/cathedral bonus counted before the +3 bonus from a German castle? (Currently we have an unofficial “yes”.)
YES - now we have an "official" yes.
The score takes first place for the roads with inn and city with cathedral and then the +3 bonus from each German castle which is involved for these features.

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14. Does the rim of the Wheel of Fortune end a road?
Yes, the road ends / starts at the rim of the Wheel of Fortune.
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13. Can the barn (or other figure that is not technically a follower) be placed on the same turn as a bridge?
YES
The use of the wooden bridge is a part of the 1st part of a players turn - "draw and place a tile" - with the bridge a road expand.
The placement of a follower or other figures like barn, builder and pig follows in the 2nd part of a players turn "move wood" phase.

see the turn sequence from the BigBox3:


I've called with Georg Wild (HiG) a few weeks before.(April 2016)
« Last Edit: April 21, 2016, 12:23:48 AM by kettlefish »

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2015, 11:53:44 AM »
10. Does a German castle count as 2 tiles for the purposes of scoring a cloister?
No, the German castle tile is one tile and counts as one tile for scoring a cloister

So a complete cloister can only score 8 points if a German Castle is next to it?

Offline jungleboy

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2015, 11:54:04 AM »
9. Does a German castle’s long edge count as 2 tiles for the purposes of barn placement? In other words, is the midpoint of a long edge counted as a corner that only needs 2 other tiles placed in order to build a barn?
This question is not yet resolved. Georg Wild and I had different opinions about it. So technically there are no 4  corners - the result of my opinion is NO. Gerorg Wild knows that, but he "feels" that the result will more a YES. So we will talk about it again.

I agree with you that it should be no for consistency purposes. In all other cases, German castles are being treated as one tile. Therefore, if there are two regular tiles alongside a German castle, this is not the intersection of four tiles but three tiles. And the CAR says: 'It [the barn] may only be placed on the point of intersection of four land tiles.'

Edit: For those joining us late in this thread, I have somewhat changed my mind about 1v2 tiles for the German Castles. Keep reading :)
« Last Edit: October 14, 2015, 09:01:11 AM by jungleboy »

Offline benbever

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2015, 03:29:19 AM »
These answers all make a lot of sense and follow from the "1 tile" rule. I play them the same way.

About 9; barn placement on 3 corners instead of 4, because of the long side of a castle:
I'd also say no.
It "looks" good at first, there's enough room for the barn, but it goes against a lot of rules.
-barn needs to be placed on for 4 corners (the place on the barn side has max 3 corners)
-barn needs to be placed on 4 tiles (with the castle it'd be 3 tiles)
-if the barn is allowed it would imply the castle counts as two tiles, and there's an invisible divide in the middle. This goes against pretty much all the other "counts as 1 tile" answers.

I'd say yes to 11, 13 and 14.

So a complete cloister can only score 8 points if a German Castle is next to it?
It can score 8 or 9 points depending on the orientation of the castle tile. With two castle tiles next to the completed cloister it could score between 7 points and 9 points (castle tiles facing away).
« Last Edit: October 14, 2015, 04:56:11 AM by benbever »

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2015, 03:40:06 AM »
Is the City of Carcassonne 1 or 12 tiles now; this will affect cloister scoring too.  What about the WoF?

Offline danisthirty

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2015, 03:48:01 AM »
9. Does a German castle’s long edge count as 2 tiles for the purposes of barn placement? In other words, is the midpoint of a long edge counted as a corner that only needs 2 other tiles placed in order to build a barn?
This question is not yet resolved. Georg Wild and I had different opinions about it. So technically there are no 4  corners - the result of my opinion is NO. Gerorg Wild knows that, but he "feels" that the result will more a YES. So we will talk about it again.

I agree with you that it should be no for consistency purposes. In all other cases, German castles are being treated as one tile. Therefore, if there are two regular tiles alongside a German castle, this is not the intersection of four tiles but three tiles. And the CAR says: 'It [the barn] may only be placed on the point of intersection of four land tiles.'

+1 from me. They've made a decision about the German Castles being 1 tile, even though they're clearly 2, so they might as well be consistent about it. If they were going to make an exception to this rule there are plenty of other places where it would make more sense to. SURELY GCs should count as 2 tiles when placed such that they occupy 2 of the spaces adjacent to a cloister. Doing anything else makes no sense to me whatsoever. Let's remember that the city of Carcassonne is now available as a single tile too. If you place a cloister adjacent to this does it mean that, potentially, the top 3 spaces only count for 1 point? It wouldn't if you used the 12-tile version of the city of Carcassonne...

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2015, 03:51:06 AM »
Also the English rules for Cloisters read: "A monastery is complete when it is surrounded by tiles."  It doesnt say surrounded by 8 tiles


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