Author Topic: 2017 Basegame League  (Read 6094 times)

Offline danisthirty

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2017 Basegame League
« on: January 23, 2017, 09:09:21 AM »
Welcome to the 2017 Basegame League! 8)

Before I announce fixtures for the first round, it's important for everyone to understand exactly how the competition will run. So I've produced the following "quick summary" which I'm hoping everyone will take the time to read through, especially those for whom this is their first online competition at Carcassonne Central...


1. All league participants will get to play two basic games against everyone else in the league. So assuming there are 30 participants, everyone will play 58 games split across 29 rounds where each round consists of two games against a single opponent. As stated above, no expansions will be used at any stage of the competition.
There are 16 of us so everyone will play 15 matches/ 30 games (each match consists of 2 games) split across 15 rounds.

2. The league will be "paced", by which I mean that fixtures for each round (who is playing who) will be announced only when the previous round has completed. Rounds will last for up to two weeks or until all games in the round have been played, and any games that have not been played by the end of the round will be forfeited (this is how our 2014 league was run albeit with a slightly different scoring system).
In an ideal world, all 120 matches (15 rounds x 8 matches per round) will take place and there won't be a single forfeited match. If any matches remain outstanding by the end of the round however, they will need to be forfeited in order for the competition to move on. The difficulty then becomes deciding which player will "win" the forfeit match and which player will "lose" if neither player recognises that they were to blame more than their oppoent and chooses to forfeit it voluntarily. I will be the judge of this in all cases, and will base my decision on who made most effort to make the match happen in terms of communication (with their opponent) as well as availability to play. Therefore, don't be the person who ignores repeated messages from their opponent only to respond after a week and a half to say that they can play that evening or not at all. ::) Please bear this in mind and include me in PMs if your opponent doesn't reply or you are worried that there is a chance your match may be forfeited. C:-)

3. The league will be a long-term commitment; if 26 (or more) players sign up to take part there will be at least 25 rounds. With each round lasting 2 weeks, this is already 50 weeks/ almost a year. With this in mind, taking part in the league won't exclude you from any other competitions and it won't delay or hold any other competitions up either, as you'll be able to play in this alongside anything else that is taking place.
There will be 15 rounds which means that this league could continue for 30 weeks which makes 20th August our latest possible completion date. Where possible, rounds will end earlier if all matches have been played though, so it is anticipated that it will, in all likelihood, finish before this.

4. Every match that you play will include a Home game (you place the first tile) and an Away game (your opponent places the first tile).
Once both players are connected through JCloisterZone and have reached the pre-game screen where you choose your meeple colour and enter your name (unless playing through the online server where you will have entered it already), the first player to select their meeple will have a "1" next to their meeple and will get to place the first tile once the game has begun. If you are about to begin your second game having placed the first tile in the first game, please allow your opponent to select their meeple colour before you so that they too will have the chance to place the first tile in the second game. And with this in mind, please don't select the "Randomize playing order" checkbox unless it's your first game and neither of you care who goes first.

5. Overall rank in the league will be determined by number of games won, then games drawn, then PD (points difference).
This was changed to match pretty much every other competition we're run whereby league points are used as the primary ranking criteria and PD (points difference) is used secondarily. If the match is won (2 games - 0), the winner gets 2 league points and the loser gets nothing. If the match is tied (1 game each), both players get 1 league point. If either (or both) game(s) results in a draw, the match could end with scores of 2 - 2 (both games tied - fairly unlikely) or 2 - 1 (a win and a draw). A result of 2 - 2 is treated as a normal tie and each player is awarded 1 league point.

More details on paced rounds, the fact that we're all part of a single group and holidays can be found in this post. Please also see the the unwritten rules for guidance regarding online etiquette and respecting other members of the community during online competitions.

Finally, don't forget that we often use an online chat room to "meet up" before games or chat in real-time afterwards. It is often useful to agree to meet your opponent here 5 - 10 minutes before your match is due to start in case of any technical problems or difficulties reaching each other. The chat room can be found here: http://sydby.com/carcassonne/irc/index.html and all are always welcome!


Please use this thread to post questions/ comments about the competition structure. Each round will have its own thread which will be linked to below as the previous round ends...

Round 1 (click)

Linkback: http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=3108.0
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 12:49:07 AM by danisthirty »
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Offline kettlefish

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2017, 10:29:54 AM »
How can we use the new double x-score list?
I am not sure if this is possible. And I am not happy with this.
I've created the list weeks before and you didn't explain what you need.
Who is filling in the double x-score list?
And why doesn't there points like usual in the leagues?
so why didn't I get a response when I've created the double x-score list?

A x-score list - with the base of the topic "Round 1"
The double x-score list - I am not happy to change the whole list  with hundreds of formulas.
The list took a week to finish it. I like to get 2 points for a win 0 points for the lost for each played game, a played tie one point for each player.
If a player wins both games of a match - then he/she gets 4 points - if both player win a game - than both player have 2 points - if one player wins a game and the other game is a tie - then he/she gets 3 points.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2017, 11:26:16 AM by kettlefish »

Offline danisthirty

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2017, 03:13:30 PM »
How can we use the new double x-score list?
I am not sure if this is possible. And I am not happy with this.
I've created the list weeks before and you didn't explain what you need.
Who is filling in the double x-score list?
And why doesn't there points like usual in the leagues?
so why didn't I get a response when I've created the double x-score list?

A x-score list - with the base of the topic "Round 1"
The double x-score list - I am not happy to change the whole list  with hundreds of formulas.
The list took a week to finish it. I like to get 2 points for a win 0 points for the lost for each played game, a played tie one point for each player.
If a player wins both games of a match - then he/she gets 4 points - if both player win a game - than both player have 2 points - if one player wins a game and the other game is a tie - then he/she gets 3 points.

This is a base game only league which means games are shorter than the ones we've played previously when expansions were included. It also means that the benefit of going first is more significant. This is why each match consists of two games; so that both players have the chance to place the first tile, to make matches last longer, and to attempt to balance out any "lucky" games where one player feels cheated that he lost a game because the other player got all the better tiles. In this way it is identical to the 2014 league which was the last time we did a base game only competition...

I can think of very few examples where competitions have been structured purely for ease of score keeping and I didn't want to make this the exception. So if accomodating this scoring mechanism in Excel is going to be a problem then I will happily put something together in SQL to do it. And will maintain it myself. Please don't feel obliged to do this yourself unless you actually want to.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2017, 11:36:12 PM »
danisthirty,
this double x-score list - I have created - was only for this league. MrNumbers helped me with the special formulas and I've put into the list hyperlinks to go through the list as fast as possible and I've explained this to MrNumbers and I tought Halfling about it. Also Decar has this list and I gave you the list too with all the information what I gave to the others - all in time around a month ago.

The reason why I like to play in this league is because of the double x-score list. MrNumbers and Halfling like to fill in the scors.

The total list is very big - that is the reason why I created smaller list to fill in the scors - automatically all scors land into the "total x-scor-16x" list and the "final list-all groups" also the "total league points".

see the example "total x-score-16x"
« Last Edit: January 24, 2017, 09:41:27 AM by kettlefish »

Offline danisthirty

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2017, 11:55:59 PM »
this double x-score list - I have created - was only for this leage. MrNumbers helped me with the special formulas and I've put into the list hyperlinks to go through the list as fast as possible and I've explained this to MrNumbers and I tought Halfling about it. Also Decar has this list and I gave you the list too with all the information what I gave to the others - all in time around a month ago.

I'm very grateful that you went to all this trouble to create it. But I'm a little confused as to why you didn't ask me how the scoring in the league would work before you did so as this is how I'd always intended it to work. I had glanced at the spreadsheet when you sent it to me the first time but I didn't have time to investigate it thoroughly. I too am very busy. Apologies for this.

The reason why I like to play in this league is because of the double x-score list. MrNumbers and Halfling like to fill in the scors.

This seems like a strange reason to take part in a competition. But if you would prefer not to take part it is better that you decide now rather than halfway through the league.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2017, 12:03:01 AM »
the only question is - please let us score like the x-score list is programmed - that is all - then we can use the list.
danisthirty - do you know how many hours MrNumbers and I worked on it and Halfling needs also time.
Also at the 21th of November I talked with you about the list and how I like to create it.

Offline danisthirty

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2017, 12:46:46 AM »
the only question is - please let us score like the x-score list is programmed - that is all - then we can use the list.
danisthirty - do you know how many hours MrNumbers and I worked on it and Halfling needs also time.
Also at the 21th of November I talked with you about the list and how I like to create it.

If you wish to use your spreadsheet to keep scores then feel free to do so. But the official scoring criteria will be as described in my post and I will keep scores if necessary.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2017, 01:44:10 AM »
OK then - if Chooselife really like to play in this league than he may use my place instead.

Offline Chooselife

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2017, 03:02:34 AM »
OK then - if Chooselife really like to play in this league than he may use my place instead.
Hi Kettlefish although I have told Dan I could step in as a backup player at any time I feel like I'm missing some posts as why I got here.
Nevertheless I don't want to step in due to any reasons not connected to the ability of any given Player keep playing His/Her games as per scheduled.

I see that part of the fuss is due to the scoring tracking. While your x-score sheets are awesome, I see that Dan decided to organize this one more like a football (soccer for the crazy Americans here) I pulled some strings on my Estoril-Praia  :yellow-meeple: :blue-meeple: :yellow-meeple: :blue-meeple: contacts and got my self a standard 16 teams tournament excel sheet.
I already adapted (and translated) part of it and it should be simple enough to keep updated.

As an example considering the 4 games already played we would have something like this:
(If I understood correctly Dan scoring Wins score 1 point and Draws score 0,5Points (which need to be rounded up so we can have a 2-1 scoring on a one win and one draw situation)



Not sure if I'm helping or just adding to the confusion........
Again if anyone really can't continue playing on the league due to any force majeure I'm here to step in if needed.


We few, we happy few, we band of brothers; For he today that sheds his blood with me, Shall be my brother;

Offline Hounk

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2017, 03:18:42 AM »
I'm glad, Dan is again on board with the League. Kettlefish, I agree, it was unfortunate, that he did not check your draft earlier, but you have also to see, that the x-table is for the League, and not the League for the spreadsheet. Primarily we all want to have fun, playing Carcassonne.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2017, 03:20:18 AM »
Danisthirty, please look for a 16th player. I am off and out of this tournament.

Offline Jéré

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2017, 03:40:00 AM »
Chooselife,

Please feel welcome. You're not stealing anybody's seat. kettlefish quits of her own free will.

I don't think we are looking for alternative solutions at the moment regarding how to display the results, although the intention is certainly to be helpful. I am confident that Dan will let us know if he is looking for help/input.

Offline jungleboy

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2017, 03:53:25 AM »
I'm glad, Dan is again on board with the League. Kettlefish, I agree, it was unfortunate, that he did not check your draft earlier, but you have also to see, that the x-table is for the League, and not the League for the spreadsheet. Primarily we all want to have fun, playing Carcassonne.

Well said and I agree. Good luck to all the players!

Offline danisthirty

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2017, 09:16:15 AM »
kettlefish, I’m sorry that you no longer wish to take part in this tournament before it has even begun, and I’m sorry for any part I’ve had in your decision :(. Ultimately though, it isn’t fair to expect me to change something I’ve put a lot of thought, time and effort of my own into just to match your spreadsheet, no matter how hard you’ve worked on it. However, if you wish to arrange another league that follows your intended scoring mechanism then I’m sure there will be plenty of volunteers here who would be glad of the chance to take part (myself included).

Welcome on board Chooselife, +1 merit for stepping in at such short notice! I wish you lots of luck in the competition (unless you’re playing against me >:D) and I hope you have fun regardless of the outcome...

As for the scoring, I don’t want anyone else to spend any time on it and risk them getting upset if I don't use it. I will put something together in my own time and will post an update at the end of each round. I have attempted to explain how the scoring will work in as much detail as possible in point 5 of this post. Please refer to that and then get back to me here if anything isn’t clear.

Primarily we all want to have fun, playing Carcassonne.

Absolutely. Couldn't have put it better myself. +1 merit for this.

I am confident that Dan will let us know if he is looking for help/input.

Agreed. -1 merit for the inevitable thrashing I will receive when we get to play our match! :P

Onwards and upwards! :(y)

Offline danisthirty

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Re: 2017 Basegame League
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2017, 04:58:56 PM »

« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 03:11:04 PM by danisthirty »


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