Author Topic: The Princess and The Dragon  (Read 1311 times)

Offline SxN

  • Duke
  • *
  • Posts: 174
  • Merit: 15
  • I haven't updated my profile yet!
    • View Profile
The Princess and The Dragon
« on: February 09, 2021, 04:31:49 AM »
Reviewing the rules captured on Wiki, I noticed the followings:

<C1 only>
- If a player draws a tile with a princess, it may be placed according to the usual rules.
Shouldn't that be rather a "must"? I don't think it is optional.

- When a tile with a volcano is placed, the player may deploy:
I think it's intended like this: "When a tile with a volcano is placed, the player may deploy the following figures to the tile:". Would also be consistent with the section following.

<C1 only>
- A follower to the (The Wheel of Fortune)
The C2 version is clearer: A meeple to the Wheel of Fortune (The Wheel of Fortune)

Finally, thanks to magic portals, more than one follower may end up on the same tile, albeit on different features. Imagine a tile with two road segments ending in a cloister and surrounded by two fields. Blue may have a claim on one road segment, Green on the other, Red on the cloister, Black as farmer on one field, Yellow on the other field. Quite a busy place, but possible, as I understand the rules. If now Blue decides to bring the Fairy to this party, then:
- the +1 point bonus applies to all the players for as long as at the beginning of their turn the Fairy is on that tile, regardless who placed her
- protection from the Dragon applies to all players, as the Dragon is prevented by Fairy to step on that tile
- the +3 bonus at feature closing applies to whoever closed the feature thanks to Fairy proximity. However, the Fairy is leaving the tile and follows only Blue when closing their road

Well, such an approach would be inconsistent with the one described for The Flier. Then again, it would be consistent with the exception noted there:

The Flier (Flying Machines): Only one follower can be "next to" (or connected to) the fairy. Thus, only one follower will receive points from the fairy. Even if another follower is placed in the same feature on the same tile (as with the Flying Machines), this would not be considered "next to" the fairy. Landing a follower on an acrobat pyramid would be the exception to this rule.

So, what's the right way for portals?

Linkback: https://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=5048.0

Offline Meepledrone

  • Owner
  • Chatelain Grand Officier
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 6292
  • Merit: 456
  • It is full of... Meeples!!!
    • View Profile
Re: The Princess and The Dragon
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2021, 01:07:42 PM »
Reviewing the rules captured on Wiki, I noticed the followings:

<C1 only>
- If a player draws a tile with a princess, it may be placed according to the usual rules.
Shouldn't that be rather a "must"? I don't think it is optional.

I had a look to the C1 rules of P&D in Big box 3 and found this wording:

Quote
When a player draws and places a princess tile, he places it following the normal rules.

It seems the authors of the CAR v7.4 used "may" as a polite "must".

- When a tile with a volcano is placed, the player may deploy:
I think it's intended like this: "When a tile with a volcano is placed, the player may deploy the following figures to the tile:". Would also be consistent with the section following.

In this case, the player may deploy:
- A tower piece (Exp. 4 - The Tower)  --> to any tile with an unoccupied  tower foundation or on top a tower without a meeple capping it.
- Barn, since that is not fully on the tile (Exp. 5 - Abbey and the Mayor) --> on a valid corner of the volcano tile.
- A bridge, as necessary (Exp. 8 - A bridge) --> On the volcano tile or an adjacent tile
- A follower to the (The Wheel of Fortune) --> This is not on the volcano tile
- Little Buildings, since they are not figures (Little Buildings) --> This is on the volcano tile
- The fairy (or move, it) --> This is not on the volcano tile

<C1 only>
- A follower to the (The Wheel of Fortune)
The C2 version is clearer: A meeple to the Wheel of Fortune (The Wheel of Fortune)

Commented above.

Finally, thanks to magic portals, more than one follower may end up on the same tile, albeit on different features. Imagine a tile with two road segments ending in a cloister and surrounded by two fields. Blue may have a claim on one road segment, Green on the other, Red on the cloister, Black as farmer on one field, Yellow on the other field. Quite a busy place, but possible, as I understand the rules. If now Blue decides to bring the Fairy to this party, then:
- the +1 point bonus applies to all the players for as long as at the beginning of their turn the Fairy is on that tile, regardless who placed her
- protection from the Dragon applies to all players, as the Dragon is prevented by Fairy to step on that tile
- the +3 bonus at feature closing applies to whoever closed the feature thanks to Fairy proximity. However, the Fairy is leaving the tile and follows only Blue when closing their road

RGG and ZMG did not translated the HiG rules faithfully and the fairy was one of affected spots. The original rules by HiG stated the fairy is always placed next to one single meeple, so:
- The +1 point bonus only applies to the active player if the fairy is next to one of their meeples at the beginning of his or her turn. The only exception is when the fairy is assigned to an acrobat in a acrobat pyramid: the active player can score up to 3 points for his/her acrobats in the pyramid.
- The +3 point bonus only applies to the player with the fairy next to one of his/her meeples on a feature being scored. A player may receive this bonus even if he/she does not have the majority in the feature.

However, the protection of the dragon affects a whole tile since the dragon cannot land on the tile with the fairy.

You may revisit the C1 rules for the fairy here:
https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/The_Princess_and_The_Dragon_(1st_edition)#The_fairy

Regarding the discrepancy in the rules by RGG and ZMG, you may check footnote #3 on the previous page:
https://wikicarpedia.com/index.php/The_Princess_and_The_Dragon_(1st_edition)#cite_note-3

 
Well, such an approach would be inconsistent with the one described for The Flier. Then again, it would be consistent with the exception noted there:

The Flier (Flying Machines): Only one follower can be "next to" (or connected to) the fairy. Thus, only one follower will receive points from the fairy. Even if another follower is placed in the same feature on the same tile (as with the Flying Machines), this would not be considered "next to" the fairy. Landing a follower on an acrobat pyramid would be the exception to this rule.

So, what's the right way for portals?

In this case, the wording for the Flier is correct. Landing on a tile via a magic portal or a flying machine does not entail automatic assignment of the fairy if it happened to be on the tile. You will have to do the assignment during your turn.

Hope this helps.
Questions about rules? Check WICA: wikicarpedia.com

Offline SxN

  • Duke
  • *
  • Posts: 174
  • Merit: 15
  • I haven't updated my profile yet!
    • View Profile
Re: The Princess and The Dragon
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2021, 09:20:18 PM »
Thanks Meepledrone for your comments. I'm wondering, though, if the Wiki should keep "the errors of the past" - if I may say so - or do better (fix the polite "must" expressed as "may", or that "the (The" fragment), considering that it acts as the current authoritative rules resource. I, for one, I think I got it.

Offline Meepledrone

  • Owner
  • Chatelain Grand Officier
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 6292
  • Merit: 456
  • It is full of... Meeples!!!
    • View Profile
Re: The Princess and The Dragon
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2021, 01:57:37 PM »
The C1 wording comes from the CAR, which tried to clarified all the issues back then. It was based on translations form German. You've already seen some issues in the rules by RGG and ZMG.

Are you sticking to the C1 rules for any particular reason?

Offline SxN

  • Duke
  • *
  • Posts: 174
  • Merit: 15
  • I haven't updated my profile yet!
    • View Profile
Re: The Princess and The Dragon
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2021, 09:11:30 AM »
In another thread, I mentioned that I'm trying to present the rules in a card format, in which one can add to the deck or take out, depending what expansions and/or variants are used, you may remember that. Although I play C2 only as I have C2 only, I'm interested in C1 too (pure C1 games, C1/C2 mixed games).

Offline Meepledrone

  • Owner
  • Chatelain Grand Officier
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 6292
  • Merit: 456
  • It is full of... Meeples!!!
    • View Profile
Re: The Princess and The Dragon
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2021, 11:09:27 AM »
Ah, OK. But in this case you can use the C2 rules that should contain relatively less "noise" from the various publishers (in theory)


Share via delicious Share via digg Share via facebook Share via furl Share via linkedin Share via myspace Share via reddit Share via stumble Share via technorati Share via twitter

  Subject / Started by Replies / Views Last post
xx
Must or may - The Princess (The Princess and The Dragon)

Started by Windekind

6 Replies
3569 Views
Last post March 11, 2019, 04:20:10 PM
by Meepledrone
xx
when move the dragon?in the expansion princess and dragon

Started by davide

3 Replies
2446 Views
Last post August 29, 2020, 05:41:41 AM
by Meepledrone
xx
Princess and the Dragon - Rule Clarifications

Started by reddalek

4 Replies
4927 Views
Last post November 16, 2016, 05:10:35 PM
by reddalek
xx
WTB: Princess and the dragon with watermarks in tiles (OLD STYLE)

Started by DrMeeple

5 Replies
1989 Views
Last post July 24, 2019, 01:56:23 AM
by DrMeeple
xx
WTB: Old art Princess and Dragon, Tower w/o watermarks

Started by DavidY

0 Replies
980 Views
Last post July 21, 2020, 08:09:47 PM
by DavidY