Carcassonne Central
Carc Central Community => The Marketplace => Topic started by: axelsson on January 25, 2018, 01:02:31 PM
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I ordered the Cult-tiles from Cundco, I picked them individually from the spare tiles and got all five of them. The artwork is similar to spielbox version, but the watermark is different. I´m not sure if that´s technically allowed, as they state that no full expansions may be ordered as individual tiles, but then again, the Cult is part of the CS&C expansion... :-X
Just wanted to thank everyone for this list.
It greatly helped me with my completionnist addiction !
Sadly, some items are no longer available on cundco &/or spielbox :
Cult Places/ Shrines (5-tile version) (spielbox)
Halflings/ Half and Half (cundco) - managed to buy it there late august
Wind Roses I (cundco) - bought it last august, and got lost in my last moving...
And one is back :
The school
I'll have to track down the precious that everyone seems to miss (Cathars, Tunnel and Plague :p). I've got my eyes on a Jubilee edition at my local store :)
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Since you asked (sort of)...
Based on the letter they sent out a while back, that would he part of what Cundco refers to as "abuse" of the spare parts service. They have said that that kind of misuse could cause them to cancel the service, and I totally understand their position. The whole thing is a goodwill gesture on their part that they already lose money on, and when we as players use it in the wrong way then they have to ask themselves whether the service is actually fulfilling the purpose it was set up for.
As someone who has twice ordered replacements for tiles and/or followers missing from used sets I have bought on eBay, I would be very unhappy if it became impossible to get replacements for legitimately lost/damaged components because of people using this system the wrong way. Imagine if one day you found that one of your tiles from an expensive expansion went missing, and there was no way to replace it except to buy the expensive set again. That's the consequence of us giving into the temptation to use the spare-part service as a shortcut for ordering, say, a Cult expansion, instead of just buying it for $5-8 on eBay, or ordering expansion 6 from Germany for maybe $20.
I was tempted, too. But let's all "just say no" to the temptation and respect the service for what it's intended to be.
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The cult tiles are in Expansion 6 - "Count, King & Robber" - they're not particularly hard to find, it seem strange to order only the cult tiles and miss out on The River 2 and The King and Robber expansion. C,S&S has 6-cult tiles.
I believe Cundco has the ability to cancel an order if they feel it is being abused. They've contacted me a few times for odds and ends I've requested or ended up sending me something else entirely. I can't see them deciding to keep tiles on the off chance someone will lose one, when they could get some money for them now tbh.
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I can't see them deciding to keep tiles on the off chance someone will lose one, when they could get some money for them now tbh.
I was in the game publishing business for 10 years. We offered a replacement parts service, and our customer service policies were initially very liberal; then later they had to be tightened up as we got taken advantage of over and over and over again. Even then, it was still an expensive effort, and never-ending.
Two things here argue against your rebuttal attempt. I already touched on these, but now I will back up my points with documentation. (1) Selling individual tiles (which are profoundly labor-intensive to fulfill) for 0.30 € each doesn't make them money, it loses them money. (2) They have expressly stated that the purpose of these tiles is to facilitate a replacement service. Would you have us believe that the "spare parts" section of their open letter (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2695.0;attach=5641), which was in part a response to player abuse of the system to obtain complete sets of 6 Crop Circles tiles at a huge discount, was just a big, fat lie?
Excerpt (emphasis mine):
- Spare parts & rarities
This leads to the next topic, our spare part service. As the name says, it is a service to replace lost or broken single tiles. There are ten-thousands of different tiles in millions of sold games, so you can imagine how hard it is to handle that in a way which satisfies all hypothetical needs. Since years we got a lot of compliments, that we care so much, even when it's just a single tile. Economically, the spare part service is a minus deal for us, since the effort is bigger than the profit. But we want to offer long-term support for our customers, because we see this as a part of our games. We built them to last (mechanically and physically), but due to a natural product, this is hard to keep up for all the time.
In fact, no single tile is produced separately. Every single game or expansion is designed and produced as a whole in one product. The separate production of every tile is simply not possible due to economical reasons (see above). So what we do is opening new games and salvage them. We just have one big shelf with a few editions of all our games and take the needed tiles out of them. It's obvious that this procedure is not able to deliver huge amounts of tiles, complete sets or even rarities. And a precise stock management of every tile is also impossible. It's all about a handful of regular tiles, which are hopefully left, so we don't have to open a new game because of a single tile.
Unfortunately we have serious problems with the “misuse” of the service. People try to order whole expansions, the half of a whole game, or rarities which where never been seen since years. Every order of this type, means a slightly annoying effort of cancelation the order, refunding the payment, informing the customer (who mostly writes back and has another question) and so on. But due to the nearly infinite possibilities, we have to keep the ordering options for spare parts open, since the effort to create a single article for every single tile would occupy us for years. As you know, Carcassonne is an always changing product.
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Now, having said all that, what should we do in these cases? Simple: Write them first and ask. I bought several Carcassonne auctions on eBay last year, and a few sets were missing some things. In a couple of cases, an unexpectedly substantial amount of stuff was missing: one entire punchboard sheet from a large expansion, and one set of wood pieces. Neither of these were from hard-to-find sets, but I still thought it best to write Cundco first to ask if it would be okay to purchase those things through the replacement service. To my delight, they said yes.
Would it have been a no if I hadn't asked first? I guess I'll never know. But even if they had refused my inquiry, then I would have understood that and chalked it up to my risk of taking a chance on a couple of eBay lots that didn't have good pictures.
In cases where the parts we need might be questionable, or numerous, writing first and asking is the right thing to do. If they don't have what we need available, or they aren't willing to provide parts that they feel are not in the spirit of a reasonable replacement request, then we're saving them all the wasted time and money of having to deal with this after the order is placed. Either way, we're holding up our side of this voluntary partnership between publisher and player.
And, if we don't feel comfortable even asking the question because we are hoping our sketchy order flies under the radar, then that right there says something about the ethics of what we are setting out to do.
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All I will say is that Cundco makes very pragmatic business decisions.
I can only assume given the millions of permutations that they are willing to support, that Cundco must have a room full of kallax shelves from ikea just full of spare parts. Spare parts, just like my spare-tire I keep in the boot of my car in the eventually I need to replace one of the 4 I'm using in the future.
With regard to the Crop-cicles Cundco made the choice to accept the dozens upon dozens of requests for this expansion. One member here boasted receiving 3 copies of it, because he and two friends all managed to wear out all 6 tiles. If it's easier for them to take the money than refuse a transaction like this, it's pretty clear: they want to take the money. I think the only trouble for Cundco was they needed to refund all the people who suddenly also needed spare tiles, after their box was empty.
As for the cult tiles: they probably have a few more boxes full of them, gathering dust since 2007. An expansions that's now EOL'd; you can't buy it. When someone places an order for 6 tiles. They'll make a business decision, as they are not obliged to accept it. Is it easier to take the money, or easier to tell them no: They are saving these tiles for someone else.
And with regard to the spare-part service I said I used: I emailed them to see if I could have a grey-abbot...having not got a reply I ordered one anyway. Rather than say it wasn't possible, it was easier for them to take the money and send me a wooden one and write a note on my receipt: "no grey, paint it". 3 weeks later they were selling Grey Abbots in their store.
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I don't particularly want to add fuel to this fire, but what I will say is that Cundco are in charge of their spare parts service and if they don't like anything about the way it's being run by them or used by their customers then they need to be the ones to initiate the change:
- If they don't like people ordering full expansions then they shouldn't fulfil those orders
- If they don't like having to communicate this back to their customers or taking part in the exchanges that ensure then they should remind us that all decisions to cancel orders are final, and that subsequent responses will be ignored (perhaps harsh, but if it would otherwise threaten the availability of the spare parts service then it's a small price to pat)
- If they don't like people ordering stuff because they think they're going to sell it on eBay then they should publish a list of what is and isn't available, and should remove anything of significant resale value
It's like being given a credit card that you can use to spend on whatever you like, as long as you don't go over the limit. What's the limit? We're not going to say, but if you do exceed it we're cancelling the card. Or to put it another way, it's like me stopping my annual giveaways because somebody requested something that I didn't want to give away. But it was on the list? I know, but I didn't want to give it away and now you've spoilt it for everyone by asking for it... >:( :(n)
I'm not trying to play devil's advocate here >:D, but my two main feelings are this:
1) If it's a major problem for them dealing with so many random orders then they need to be clear about what's acceptable and what isn't
2) We're a fan-community with no direct affiliation with Cundco and it isn't up to us to be enforcing rules on their behalf, or guilt-tripping others who may have made decisions we deem to be questionable
Communication is key! If everyone knows where we are then everyone wins; us and them 8)
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I should just add that I'm not intent on attacking cundco's reputation. We living in a capitalist world, i don't think there's anything wrong with the 'take the money' approach. I think they operate with integrity. In fact they even rectified issues too.
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not to take some fuel of the fire, but they have a list of available tiles, that has been updated November 2017, that states the tiles available
https://cundco.de/media/pdf/cc/1b/d9/aktuell-im-web-Komplett-Pla-ttchenliste-CundCo-aktuell.pdf
The sheet is now up to date with all the spin offs and everything :)
and they state on the website that they cannot guarantee the tiles will be available, and a refund will be given if not.
They also state do not deliver complete sets / almost complete sets.
And i kinda assume they don't deliver if they suspect someone is misusing the service
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Thanks Willem, I hadn't spotted any of that! ;)
Now all they need to do is stick by what they've said they will and won't fulfil. The minute they start sending people stuff that isn't on the list is where it all falls apart and nobody knows what is and isn't acceptable.
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They need to cross out the Katherer tiles before someone makes a go of it.
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I 've to confess it. I tryed to get mini 5 Magic and Mage by this way. I obviously recieved a letter with all you say above(Just a Bill). I bought it to a private. I will follow Just a Bill's advice, the next time I need to get something.
I take this situation to indicate my doubts in this regard.
Why do not they sell full expansions? If they are expensives make one, they make plenty of them. there are many of us very interesting about them.
why don't make full expansion preorder?
Dan, they don't give me my money back, when I ordered my grey abbot. they said...
"Unfortunately, the abbot in gray is not available in the moment. Therefore you will get the following voucher code (€ 0,30) for your next buying in our webshop."
I don't know if they sell me now.
I would like more opinions about Cundco service. Please...
And Finaly, Peace between us.
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They need to cross out the Katherer tiles before someone makes a go of it.
Maybe they found some spare ones ???
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They need to cross out the Katherer tiles before someone makes a go of it.
Maybe they found some spare ones ???
Great! I used to have 15 sets of this but I lost them all. I wonder if they'd replace them? >:D
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They need to cross out the Katherer tiles before someone makes a go of it.
Maybe they found some spare ones ???
Great! I used to have 15 sets of this but I lost them all. I wonder if they'd replace them? >:D
You can have mine. >:D >:D >:D
They are very beautifull ::)
(https://sp0q3g.bn1.livefilestore.com/y4miKa7u78FEtPcI6G_f1Bonfx0vN1tvU4nFg6G7qiv3ja2n6MCW7nRy-9Jdqv0I_rxLsFlMfw2qR6JpGRQz2qcs5MO-arGmUZo-XrP-lKdi6MN6l1rBXLaHqikMoqTBO6QRrcKpXPy89Us2p2a9vHjYUnyLRxFmW41Ki8jSaTETJ0QD6QlMAuPDpncdw52xu35ftIOrquMHVZOIh6brm-Lsw?width=660&height=371&cropmode=none)
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6 of us could order one each and then have a round Robin Jcz tournament to see who gets the whole set!
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Hahahaha!
That is the best idea ever!
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Halfling that is actually a great idea.
Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk
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If you look very carefully there is a set of those on Aenima's secret Santa clock. They can't be that rare can they.
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I have them already but the chance to get the set for 20cents........ Who's up for it?
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"Unfortunately, the abbot in gray is not available in the moment. Therefore you will get the following voucher code (€ 0,30) for your next buying in our webshop."
Nice - was this using their new shop? They seem to have a much better stock control system now.
I also once ordered a blue teacher meeple and they sent me a complete blue-teacher meeple set with a blue bag, which was very kind of them!
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It sounds like you guys are saying that our job is to try to game the system and get as much as we can possibly get, and it's up to Cundco to catch us and stop us. That's depressing, and I reject that premise.
Look, I'm not exactly a defender of HiG. They've made plenty of decisions that I disagreed with. But Cundco has generally done right by me, and the replacement service is a difficult thing for them to police. They have to juggle the competing desires of giving good customer service to Player A today, vs. not getting taken advantage of and making sure they can still give good customer service to player B tomorrow. Do they always make the perfect call on every order? Of course not. But that doesn't negate the stated purpose of the replacement part service, nor does it get me off the hook for being reasonable and respectful in how I use it.
As I said before, the more we try to game the system, the more that service is likely to go away. And that would be the biggest tragedy in all of this. Go right ahead and criticize me for holding this position... but over my lifetime I've seen too many good things get destroyed by everyone thinking they can each bend the rules to their advantage, and when I see that potential I'm not going to be silent about it.
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I have them already but the chance to get the set for 20cents........ Who's up for it?
Why would you pay 4Euros for shipping when you could just say you're ordering 3 copies for your friends who also lost the tiles? That way you can order 3 copies of all the tiles for $3 and sell the other 2 sets on eBay for $100 each next week (plus $40 postage).
I hyperbolize of course.
When it comes to tiles: I wish Cundco would just sell off their remaining stock (which they did with Besigers and the old festival tiles), after a number of years, when they no longer wish to support the expansions and once requests for replacement has dwindled. I'd rather Cundco got 50$ for a set of cathars than some tout on ebay.
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It sounds like you guys are saying that our job is to try to game the system and get as much as we can possibly get, and it's up to Cundco to catch us and stop us. That's depressing, and I reject that premise.
What I'm saying is that Cundco is a business who need to be in charge of what they do and don't want to sell. They're not a kindly old lady who lives down the road and offers amazing apple pies to her neighbours and they're like "wow these pies are great but I feel bad for accepting them all the time because we only ever really speak to her when we want pies and she must have realised this by now" but as guilty as they feel about keep accepting her pies they never say no to them because they just love pie so much.
I thought I'd been clear about that?
Don't get depressed Bill. There's far worse things going on in the world than Cundco giving all their pies away to unjust causes.
Yes I've had whisky.
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not to take some fuel of the fire, but they have a list of available tiles, that has been updated November 2017, that states the tiles available
https://cundco.de/media/pdf/cc/1b/d9/aktuell-im-web-Komplett-Pla-ttchenliste-CundCo-aktuell.pdf
The sheet is now up to date with all the spin offs and everything :)
Thanks, Willem, I've been looking for a document like that for ages (merit) ... it's useful to know what's on tiles in sets I don't have in case I might be able to use it for fan expansion development, to save creating it from scratch or finding other clipart ...
Ark seems to be missing, though ...
EDIT: Found the followng on CarcF "Die Plättchen für "Die Baumeister des Königs" fehlen, weil diese Carcassonne-Version nicht beim "Hans im Glück-Verlag" erschienen ist." which seems to translate approximately as "Tiles for Ark are missing because HiG is not the publisher"
It would be useful to have the same for all the different meeples they have available (for the other games in particular).
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They need to cross out the Katherer tiles before someone makes a go of it.
Maybe they found some spare ones ???
Great! I used to have 15 sets of this but I lost them all. I wonder if they'd replace them? >:D
Maybe they found your lost ones ...
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It would be useful to have the same for all the different meeples they have available (for the other games in particular).
As I've got almost all of the spin-offs, I've made some pictures of these. See attached :)
Had to resize it to be small enough, but can send the original pictures if needed :)
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Many thanks, Willem. Just what I was looking for. If, for example, I want a specific piece for whatever, I can see if there is anything available at CundCo as spare parts (and where I may have more regular orders) before I turn to www.spielematerial.de.
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Hi fellow ssonnes of Carca,
Just thought I'd throw my experience with Cundco in here whilst still fresh. I've come to the Carcassonne obsession very late in the game -- nouveau riche etc. -- and have been trawling the web for sources to fill the inevitable gaps. I used Cundco yesterday after realising they were a legitimate spare parts vendor. However I found their service a little passive aggressive. First of all, let me preface this anecdote by saying that they have been very helpful (and rather cheap) in sourcing pieces I would otherwise have a harder time getting; I bought 55 pieces (18*orange, 18*purple, 18*white, 4*abbot in orange, purple, white, and grey). They responded quite quickly to tell me they had removed the grey abbot. Now, I'm absolutely fine with this as I'd read on their website that abbots are typically problematic and also read on here ongoing problems with the piece in general, and that it shouldn't be taken personally. What I wasn't fine with, however, is that (a) the same e-mail went on to tell me they had already shipped my order (54 pieces), (b) they didn't give me any notification of confirming whether this was OK before doing so, and (c) didn't refund me the difference but provided a store credit "voucher" (even though it claims a refund will occur on the spare parts page). A lot of you might find this petty but given I live in Australia, shipping is both exceptionally longer and more expensive than most people on here can sympathise with. Therefore getting sent an unconfirmed 54-piece order and then having to muck about to buy a single piece with the exact same postage is just horrible commerce. I sent a couple of placid e-mails querying what was happening and got no response (admittedly it was 3PM Friday).
So, on one hand I am very aware and respectful of Cundco for the amazing opportunity they are providing for owners, fans, and completionists alike. But on the other I am frustrated as others have voiced here that there is no absolute consistency, structure, or clarity to the process. You can't change a 55-piece order with no option for the buyer to review the stock update prior to shipment. If they had, I would have added another abbot (if possible), about 5 replacement tiles, another whole colour set, and a set of the "teacher" meeples to the order. It's an odd thing to not have more time to establish communications between buyer/seller or at least have a very specific set of rules with which to follow to avoid pissing them off and/or abusing the process. As I said, at the end of it all, I'm glad this service exists but it does feel like Cundco resent it/us on some base level and I'm left with this incredibly bittersweet feeling. Danisthirty's earlier credit card analogy is dead accurate here.
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Well the spare part service is for People who lost parts at first.
Second yeah it is not the way it should be. I have had a missing tile in my order and sent them a email and 4 days later I had the tile.
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Just an update. I've since committed about 3 separate orders from Cundco with only one slight mistake which they happily fixed in the following shipment. The letters/parcels also arrive quite fast. I'm not sure why, but pretty much everything coming from Germany (to Australia) is BY FAR the fastest and cheapest. And this was just for standard Deutsche Post Brief. Really impressed.
Regards,