Bests Spin-Off Games

[Whaleyland]

Maybe whaleyland would like to chime in on this topic as he is usually on top of stuff like this!

I agree with danisthirty. Email either Z-Man or Hans im Glück. Both usually respond quickly (although maybe not HiG right now) and they are usually honest about things, although if they are anticipating a future release they may keep things hush-hush until the announcement. Currently out of print are The Castle, The City, The Discovery, and Mayflower/New World. Since Winter Edition is new, I imagine it will see a reprint, but probably not with scoring tiles or Gingerbread Man. I really wish The Castle saw a reprint with The Falcon, but the lack of its inclusion suggests neither company is currently interested in reprinting the game. The City probably needs the largest graphic overhaul of the series but we'll have to see if that ever comes about. I'd say email them but don't expect a full answer.

[jungleboy]

Thanks guys. I tweeted them so we'll see if they respond that way. Email is for chumps

[jungleboy]

Thanks guys. I tweeted them so we'll see if they respond that way. Email is for chumps

They haven't replied yet, so maybe it's twitter that's for chumps...

[Lord_Wishmaster]

Only just noticed that this one has been 're-activated' of late.

The only two spin-offs that I don't currently own are Goldrush and Star Wars. On that basis I guess I'm in a reasonable position to comment. Since my last comment,some two and half years back(!) I've got round to playing all that I owned and hadn't played, plus bought new ones, so, in no particular order, current feelings with observations are:

The Castle: The only Carcassonne game deliberately made for just 2 players. Reiner Knizia is probably my favourite game designer, the guys a genius. I have several of his games and all are different to each other. Likewise, The Castle is different from all the other Carcassonnes. Tactia, back in 2013, described it as ugly and I said different. I stand by that still, although I may have revised that my opinion of it being best spin-off.... see further down!

Hunters & Gatherers: This was the first spin-off to be released. Like those that have followed there is a strong argument to be made that once you have the main game the rest are the same game, different design. Hunters probably comes the closest to that statements truth. However, the game is the game and it's the 'tweaks' that we will probably be buying them for. Extra pieces, in this case the Huts, make it interesting, plus the abilty to gain a nugget card - some of which are just basically another normal tile but some have interesting extras. I liked it on release but as more spin-offs came out I tend not to jump to this as first choice so much, more a case of not played it for a while so let's have a go.

The Discovery: This ones a bit odd. On release it was described as a simpler version of Carcassonne thus making it ideal for 'younger players'. Actually it's the most technically and strategically challenging of the lot! Less meeples and you can only place or take back, not both. Also you can remove and take a partial score without completing. Scoring is not nearly as obvious/direct as the other games either, and for some reason most players will sit and twist the tiles round and round having trouble knowing the best place to put them! For all these reasons, it goes very near the top of the list!

New World: This is the one that really divides people here it would seem. Took me a while to get round to bothering to play it some time after purchase (Mind you, only a year.... I've had some games 6+ years before playing, see below!). Once you understand it's concept it plays well. It was, to my mind, a rather rushed job on issue. The Rules were perhaps not read through as thoroughly as previous games and a couple of bits not explained as well as they could have been. Once you apply some thoughtful logic to it, all becomes obvious. The big rules gap is that you should only play it to the width of the starting board all the way 'up' the game. Once you 'get' that concept, it's brilliant and this coupled with the surveyors taking meeples off the board turns it into a game unlike the other spin-offs. A 'speed carcassonne' if you like with a need to grab small points fast rather than attempt big builds for big points.

The City: I have the original version in the wooden box. Not seen the current release but I'm assuming it's the same game in a standard size cardboard box? So, this is one of those games that I owned a while..... at least six years actually, could be longer.... before playing it! We finally did the deed just three weeks ago. Why did we wait sooooo long!? This is a fantastic take on the original game! It's not as obvious where things go to start with as some are. Even before you look at the walls and towers there is a fair amount to take in. The walls are a clever addition. There's no point bringing out a spin-off that does exactly the same as the original, and that's why we have some wooden walls. There use as well as giving something else for Mr Meeple to do also contain the games size, so much so that it becomes the only Carcassonne game that can end before all the tiles are used up. Having finally 'discovered' it, we've played it quite a few times now.... Although the following is a worthwhile observation - I love it, my daughter of 28, hates it!

Ark Of The Covenant: Am I correct in saying that this one was only available in the USA? Very difficalt to find these days. Mine came from eBay some time ago. Don't be put off by it's bible theme if you are not that way inclined. I've not played this one a lot, certainly not recently. The novelty here is the Ark itself. You have the option of moving it instead of placing meeples. The rest plays out pretty straight and true as Carcassonne in the desert. I've always felt that the Ark piece is a bit naff, a square of card in a plastic stand. Missed opportunity there, a nice 'collectable' pewter ark would have been very nice..... and I've not found something suitable as yet! Probably not one to race out for straight away, but definitely required at some point for the set.

Winter Edition: As stated by someone else, this basically the base game with snow art on the tiles. However, this is actually my wife's favourite spin-off simply because of that artwork. She says it gives it a much more tactile, calming feel whilst playing. There are a couple of different tiles not in the base game, plus mine came with the Gingerbread man six tile (and Mr GB himself) expansion. Quite frankly I would suggest only getting it if you have this too. With that included it's a good game but possibly only as an extra.

Wheel Of Fortune: Had this a few years before playing too! Another odd one to bring out as a complete game. As such, this is the base game minus the start tile, plus the large wheel board to use instead. I suspect a money making plan was hatched! It could have been issued as an expansion with just the required extras. That said, I would suggest playing it only as a stand-alone game. You get pretty much the same tiles as the base game, but some have numbered wheel symbols on them that 'activate the wheel' A pig moves around the wheel, and more points can be scored. The wheel is somewhere else to place meeples. Why only play it as stand-alone? If you add more to it, the 'wheel' tiles won't come out often enough, which negates the point of placing meeples on the wheel.

South Seas: Right at the top of this rather long missive I said I had changed my mind about The Castle being the best spin-off.... and this one is the reason why. If you've not bought it yet, this is my advice... stop reading and go to your favourite place of purchase immediately! Go on, just do it!! So, yes, I like this one a lot. It's fast, it's fun... no make that FUN. In a way it takes the concept of Discovery (only 4 meeples, place or take back, not both) and delivers it all in a beautiful quick easy wrapping. It's also the only Carcassonne game not to incluse a scoreboard, now that's different. It has a currency, wooden bananas, fish and shells (lots of them), little boats and ships to purchase with your wood. In many ways it takes the game to somewhere completely different. Total winner.

....And so, that's all the spin-offs that I own, which just leaves............

Goldrush: Without owning I can't say for sure, but it looks like it's back to more of the basic Carcassonne rules but you get tents as well?

Star Wars: I really was totally disinterested when I first heard about this one. I'm a Carcassonne fan, and a Star Wars fan (the new one is fantastic, proper Star Wars is back!), but together?!! However, having looked at the pictures, briefly seen the rules, gone through the reviews.... I think I'll need to add it.

Kids of Carcassonne: Mine are grown up. No.

If you've got this far... God help you!! 

[Decar]

+ Over Hills & Dales

[ARabidMeerkat]

The Ark is also a fun little mechanic, albeit one that was later adopted in Carcassonne expansions to a degree.

Which expansion to some degree did this become?

[danisthirty]

Thanks for that comprehensive summary Lord_Wishmaster!

I was going to point out that you hadn't mentioned Over Hill & Dale but Decar beat me to it! Plus of course there are all those games in the middle ground that aren't quite spin-offs but aren't typical expansions either (CarDcassonne, Carcassonne the Dice Game, Travel Carcassonne etc). Do you have any opinion on any of these?

The City: ... as giving something else for Mr Meeple to do also contain the games size, so much so that it becomes the only Carcassonne game that can end before all the tiles are used up. Having finally 'discovered' it, we've played it quite a few times now.... Although the following is a worthwhile observation - I love it, my daughter of 28, hates it!

South Seas can also end before all the tiles are used up if all of the ship tokens get bought. In my experience this is quite often the case in 2-player games. Also, it frequently happens in Kids of Carcassonne which I've probably played at least 15 times so far this year!

[jungleboy]

The only two spin-offs that I don't currently own are Goldrush and Star Wars. On that basis I guess I'm in a reasonable position to comment. Since my last comment,some two and half years back(!) I've got round to playing all that I owned and hadn't played, plus bought new ones, so, in no particular order, current feelings with observations are:

Great summaries - merit for you!

The Discovery: This ones a bit odd. On release it was described as a simpler version of Carcassonne thus making it ideal for 'younger players'. Actually it's the most technically and strategically challenging of the lot! Less meeples and you can only place or take back, not both. Also you can remove and take a partial score without completing. Scoring is not nearly as obvious/direct as the other games either, and for some reason most players will sit and twist the tiles round and round having trouble knowing the best place to put them! For all these reasons, it goes very near the top of the list!

I'm almost intrigued by this ... but not quite. I'm not an uber-completionist and I already have 5 spin-offs. So unless it offers dramatically different gameplay from the original or from H&G/the Ark (e.g. the Castle or the City), I would only get it if I were blown away by the theme and the design/components. And I'm not.

South Seas: Right at the top of this rather long missive I said I had changed my mind about The Castle being the best spin-off.... and this one is the reason why. If you've not bought it yet, this is my advice... stop reading and go to your favourite place of purchase immediately! Go on, just do it!! So, yes, I like this one a lot. It's fast, it's fun... no make that FUN. In a way it takes the concept of Discovery (only 4 meeples, place or take back, not both) and delivers it all in a beautiful quick easy wrapping. It's also the only Carcassonne game not to incluse a scoreboard, now that's different. It has a currency, wooden bananas, fish and shells (lots of them), little boats and ships to purchase with your wood. In many ways it takes the game to somewhere completely different. Total winner.

This is the other one that I don't have that seems a little intriguing. The gameplay seems different enough to make it interesting, but here it's the theme that I'm not into. The Pacific and this theme is just so far removed from the medieval south of France that I can't really envisage it as a 'Carcassonne' game.

[Lord_Wishmaster]

Ah yes, Hills and dales. Sorry missed that one. Have to be honest, I know practically nothing about it. Just looked a little on the whimsical side to me?

Travel Carcassonne: Not so much a Spin-off, more the base game in miniature. Total missed opportunity in my opinion. I've said this before in another thread, a travel game should be in something, a grid, magnetic etc etc, so that it can me played whilst on the move. I guess it depends on your take of 'travel'. If you mean it can go away with you, then just put the base game in a smaller box!

Dice and Cards... I have no idea so can not comment really. Did look online at the card version when it first appeared. I'll leave that one for others!

[Lord_Wishmaster]

Jungleboy... By your criteria for bying, I would say get both Discovery and South Seas.
South Seas is a no-brainer as far as I'm concerned, but had I not been given it as a present I might not have gone out and bought it... what a miss that would have been. Yes, I see what you mean regards the non-theme of Carcassonne, but I think we just have to take the name more as a branding than what the original game was based around here.

Danisthirsty.... Yes, of course you are correct that South Seas can end before all the tiles are out. Good spot. It's happened to us a few times too.

[Decar]

Discovery has very different game play.  So much so, it didn't feel very Carcassonne at all.  There are essentially 3 types of city and not enough joining pieces.  The landscape becomes blobs.  The scoring is clunky (it applies the 2-point city rule to every type) & there is incomplete feature scoring, by removing your meeple early is nice - like The Abbot in Carcassonne 2.0.  The scoreboard only goes upto 50.  I quite liked the artwork and theme, but didn't enjoy the game play.  It's brave for being different, but I don't think it had the legs. 

You're not missing much Jungleboy.

[Decar]

The Pacific and this theme is just so far removed from the medieval south of France that I can't really envisage it as a 'Carcassonne' game.

Best avoid Carcassonne Star Wars!  That's set in a galaxy Far Far away 

[Lord_Wishmaster]

Discovery has very different game play.  So much so, it didn't feel very Carcassonne at all.  There are essentially 3 types of city and not enough joining pieces.  The landscape becomes blobs.  The scoring is clunky (it applies the 2-point city rule to every type) & there is incomplete feature scoring, by removing your meeple early is nice - like The Abbot in Carcassonne 2.0.  The scoreboard only goes upto 50.  I quite liked the artwork and theme, but didn't enjoy the game play.  It's brave for being different, but I don't think it had the legs. 

You're not missing much Jungleboy.

Couldn't disagree more! I think it makes for a great game. As I said earlier, to me there is very little point in a spin-off repeating what's already happened in the base game, and this takes that on board. It uses the Carcassonne concept and then makes it play very differently. It really stretches the player and makes him plan ahead and think about his strategy. I will grant you that the scoring takes some getting used to but it's OK once grasped.... the player aid cards are best left in the bottom of the box mind!

'the Scoreboard only goes up to 50'.... er, pretty standard Carcassonne scoreboard then! All of them only go up to 50. Methinks someone has got a bit to used to using his home made scoreboards maybe?! 

Regards your Star Wars comment... perhaps you give yourself away there, possibly explaining the Discovery comments too.... 'It ain't Carcassonne so I ain't playing it'?? 

[danisthirty]

'the Scoreboard only goes up to 50'.... er, pretty standard Carcassonne scoreboard then! All of them only go up to 50.

This one doesn't.

[jungleboy]

This one doesn't.

Oh stop it. That scoreboard is a myth.

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