Carcassonne Central

Carc Central Community => Online Games and Competitions => Leagues (including expansion leagues) => Topic started by: danisthirty on April 15, 2014, 06:07:20 AM

Title: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 15, 2014, 06:07:20 AM
Has anybody here ever taken part in a Carcassonne league? A friend suggested something similar recently but it doesn't look like this is going to happen so I wondered about trying to set something up online using JCloisterZone or some other method of online play.

Some initial thoughts:

- Each match is a head-to-head between two players
- Each match is made up of two games
- Games consist of just the initial 72 tiles i.e. no expansions
- Players earn 3 points for a win (if they win both games of their match) or 1 point for a draw (if they win one/ lose one)
- Scores could be kept via a thread on the forums here and screenshots could be posted for proof (or purely out of interest)
- The player with the highest score once everyone has played everyone else would be the champion

The idea of being able to take part in a league is something I find very exciting. I don't imagine there would be prizes, but the opportunity to play against other highly-skilled Carcassonne enthusiasts would be prize enough for me. After all, playing against new opponents is the best way (in my opinion) to learn from your mistakes and improve your tactics.

I'm keen to hear any thoughts and/or suggestions!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on April 15, 2014, 11:33:27 AM
I would be interested in something like this. Sounds like it could be fun.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 15, 2014, 11:49:04 AM
I have not looked at JCloisterZone yet.  If it is good to play with, this would be interesting.

Keeping it a level playing field by restricting it to only the base game makes sense.  You could play with any combination of expansions, but for a league, to keep it far, all games would need to play with the same expansion.

By using software, assuming the software will network through IP, this open the option of making it a worldwide league.  Very interesting.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Paul on April 15, 2014, 11:57:43 AM
If you are patient, can set up a webcam game. One host the game and the other player(s) go 'left, left, further left, yes, next to that cloister, extend that road to its right and put one of my followers on it!'

 :meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 15, 2014, 12:24:49 PM
@rfielder - I've not played an online game using JCloisterZone yet but it wouldn't necessarily be limited to this as people with the iPhone app or the Facebook app could play against each other depending on preference. Sticking to the basic tiles just helps to keep things simple and consistent.

@Yellow - I'm hoping it will be a little more sophisticated than that!  :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on April 15, 2014, 02:20:47 PM
I'm definitely up for this. It might be a bit difficult to arrange all the head-to-head matches with different timezones though. Maybe we could have continental 'conferences', with the winners of each conference advancing to the final round or something like that?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 15, 2014, 02:53:04 PM
@jungleboy - yes timezones could certainly be a problem although not an insurmountable one with a bit of planning hopefully.

At the moment, the biggest problem I can see is how the games would actually be run. The two best options are probably the iPhone/ iPad app and the Facebook app. I don't have an iAnything and I don't suppose I'm alone in this. Also, I don't think the Facebook app is officially recognised by Hans im Gluck, nor is it free, which could be a problem for some.

I was pinning my hopes on the network play features of JCloisterZone but I've since discovered that these are specific to local networks rather than the internet. It may be possible to get a game to work using VPN software or some such thing but this seems prohibitively complicated and would undoubtedly put people off (myself included).

Is anybody else aware of any other websites/ freely available apps that can be used to play Carcassonne online? I've found Brettspielwelt but this is German for one thing and I haven't been able to get into a game on it yet.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on April 15, 2014, 04:12:32 PM
I also do not own an iAnything! and I still don't know if I'm happy or sad about that...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on April 15, 2014, 11:59:41 PM
I was pinning my hopes on the network play features of JCloisterZone but I've since discovered that these are specific to local networks rather than the internet. It may be possible to get a game to work using VPN software or some such thing but this seems prohibitively complicated and would undoubtedly put people off (myself included).

JCloisterZone can be played through the Internet, if at least one player have a dedicated (real) IP address. And if this player has a Wi-Fi router, he has to setup appropriate port forwarding on it to be able to play.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 16, 2014, 12:33:24 AM
@MrNumbers - thanks for that. How difficult would it be for an average Joe like me to set this up?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on April 16, 2014, 01:11:35 AM
@MrNumbers - thanks for that. How difficult would it be for an average Joe like me to set this up?

Not so difficult.
1. You must assign a static local IP address to you PC
or
in DHCP settings of a router assign permanent lease for particular PC, based on it's MAC address.
2. Find "Port forwarding" settings in a router and fill in two things - your PC's local IP address and some random port (better in range 10000-32000).
3. Restart the router to changes take effect.

So, after that, you can host an Internet game, but you opponent must use you real IP address to connect to, and port that you have defined in "Port forwarding" settings section. You real IP address you can find out using one of the Internet services, for example, http://www.whatismyip.com

P.S. Once again, only one of the players (host) must have this configured. The other player doesn't need to do anything specific, except knowing real IP address and port number of the host.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 17, 2014, 05:21:46 AM
@MrNumbers - thanks so much for your advice. If we get more than a handful of people interested in competing then this will certainly make a league decidedly more possible!

As much as anything else I think it will be a good opportunity for forum members to get to know each other a little better/ build friendships/ bring world peace etc.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on April 17, 2014, 05:35:45 AM
@MrNumbers - thanks so much for your advice. If we get more than a handful of people interested in competing then this will certainly make a league decidedly more possible!

You are welcome! ;)
For the record: I am one of JCloisterZone beta-testers and the author of Russian translation 8)
And maybe I haven't explicitly mentioned: I also support the idea of the league :(y)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 17, 2014, 05:58:23 AM
Not so difficult.
1. You must assign a static local IP address to you PC
or
in DHCP settings of a router assign permanent lease for particular PC, based on it's MAC address.
..etc
MrNumbers - You make it sound so very, very easy!  I am sorry, but for 99% of the world, your explanation is complete gobbldygook.

Yes, it is easy, if you work in this field.  Otherwise, you need the assistance of someone who does.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 17, 2014, 06:08:07 AM
The difficulty for something like this (an open league) was always going to be making the actual games take place on a technical level. I believe those with iPhones should be able to play each other relatively easily (I don't know for sure as I don't have one), and it shouldn't be too difficult for those on Facebook either. JCloisterZone seems like a good fit for those who can't use either of the other methods and I'm fairly sure based on what MrNumbers has said that it won't require everyone to be a dab hand at networking, just a few!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: AlbinoAsian on April 17, 2014, 09:26:55 AM
My friends and I did a league competition on BSW. It was hard work because of timezone issues. As we'd moved all around the world, but we managed to make it work and it was a great deal of fun!

We gave each round a timeslot of 2 weeks to make sure they could schedule in a match
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 17, 2014, 10:25:19 AM
My friends and I did a league competition on BSW. .....
What is BSW?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on April 17, 2014, 10:30:21 AM
My friends and I did a league competition on BSW. .....
What is BSW?
BSW is the brettspielwelt (http://www.brettspielwelt.de/)

There you can play many board games online.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 23, 2014, 10:00:53 AM
I did have a quick look at this and it seemed like a convenient way to play but I'd read that it only supported second edition farmer scoring. Does anyone know if this is still the case?

@AlbinoAsian - I like the idea of having a set amount of time for players to arrange a game between themselves, thanks for the tip!

Is anybody else interested?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jvnoledawg on April 23, 2014, 04:18:45 PM
I'd be in favor of it, if it's simple to do (that is, login somewhere and play)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on April 23, 2014, 04:32:53 PM
I am in
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 24, 2014, 06:15:25 AM
I have the Carcassonne game running on my PCs, and have linked it between two of my PCs.  There are five PCs and two laptops on my home network.

Have not actually played a game yet, but will do that as soon as possible - which is next week at the earliest.

Have not tried to link to this game from outside my network.  Not sure how that will work, since everything on my network is a 192.168.0.xxx address.

Have played the game a bit, to see how it works, and I must say this is not the same as playing on a table.  Zoom out far enough to see the board, and the tiles can get too small to recognize.  Panning around works, but like zooming, it will take some getting used to.  I am almost willing to be that those who win games are those who have spent the most time getting used to playing on a PC, regardless of their actual skill level.

It is nice, and useful, that the game always lists all possible locations for your next tile.

If we can make it work, I am in for some gameplay, and a tournament.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jvnoledawg on April 24, 2014, 05:53:58 PM
I've played a few games vs the computer with the JCloisterZone program.  I really like it, and think it would work for us.

And an interesting note, had I not done this, I never would have realized that we (my family) have been playing barns incorrectly.  For some reason we thought you had to have a farm before you could put a barn on it.  when the computer starting taking my farm with a barn, I thought something was wrong, so I went back to the CAR and discovered our error.

Anyway, using this method could work.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 25, 2014, 03:39:13 AM
Hello! Quick update on this as I'm aware that I'm not moving things along very quickly and I don't want people to lose interest. So far it seems we have six or seven interested players (Carcking, rfielder, jungleboy, jvnoledawg, Rosco and I [and MrNumbers?]) which I think is a good number to see how things work out although obviously it's not too late for anyone else to join in if they want to.

@jvnoledawg - I know what you mean! Certainly for big games with several expansions anyway, as the AI opponents take their turns so quickly (as you'd expect from a computer) that it's difficult to keep track of everything that's going on and it doesn't help when you can't see the full landscape at a glance like you can when you play in person. I don't think this will be such a big problem when played against human opposition though as the game will be slower and you can take your time to zoom in and out as required before placing a tile. Obviously it varies from game to game, but I've posted a screenshot of a game I played this morning which is zoomed-out to the point that the entire landscape can be seen in sufficient, playable detail (for me anyway).

Similarly, I don't think any level of familiarity with JCloisterZone is going to be a significant enough benefit to anyone such that it would skew any individual results, but there are still alternatives available and at the end of the day it will be up to the two people who are playing against each other to decide how they're going to play. This seems like the fairest, most practical way of making things happen to me!

@rfielder - please let me know how you got on! Did you manage to set a static IP address for the computer you used to host the game and did you open a dedicated port for it as per MrNumbers' advice? If at least half the people in the league are able to host JCloisterZone games then it should be relatively simple for the other half to connect to them.

In other news I am still looking at BSW although I struggled to get this working at first because of silly Java security problems. Even once I'd managed to get into the lobby I wasn't quite sure what to do as I don't speak German for one thing, but hopefully I can work out how to get a game going (advice from anyone with experience of this would be greatly appreciated!) and will be able to present this as another suitable alternative to JCloisterZone, Facebook and the iPhone app.

All being well, I'm aiming to finalise some of the arrangements by 1st May and am hoping that we can get things going properly soon after this. Any thoughts/ suggestions/ advice etc please let me know!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on April 25, 2014, 06:44:27 AM
Jcloister I use for my games solo, if you manage to make it work could be interested in understanding how to use the network and to match with you.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on April 25, 2014, 07:53:42 AM
There is a setting in JCloister so that it shows what the last tile placement was.

I like JCloister quite a bit and play it often against the AI. The system is somewhat limited in that there are not higher levels of AI difficulty. Often times the AI makes weird choices to place tiles and followers. At other times it feels like it knows exactly what you're trying to do and cuts you off at every turn. I usually challenge myself by waiting till very late to deploy Farmers and then try to get them glommed into the AI farms. Or I try to win without Farmers. Same with Barns. I don't place mine till they place theirs - then I try to either protect my farm if it's larger or glom in if theirs is larger.

One thing I love is it has the option for the 2 point two-tile city.

Farm scoring is kind of a hybrid. It scores like 3rd edition but any player can only score a particular city once no matter how many farms he has supplying it. I actually like that because it keeps farm scoring somewhat in check. (It's been no secret that I'm not a fan of the changes HiG made in the 3rd edition with farm scoring and two-tile cities. I think they nearly broke the game. But I digress - that's a topic for some other thread. :) )
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on April 25, 2014, 12:09:34 PM
I am definitely interested! :red-meeple:

As for JCloisterZone: in version 1.6 there was much better AI, that could not be beaten so easy. After major code rewriting now there are many new expansions and options, but AI isn't good enough. Although, the author promises that in some future versions he will improve AI level.

The hardest AI level I ever seen is in German PC version of Carcassonne (this one: http://www.amazon.de/Koch-Media-Carcassonne-PC-Download/dp/B005O2Y82U) - 10 levels of AI and the 10th level I can beat only in 50% of games. This version also has an option to play over the Internet, but still this product must be purchased, which is the only "minus" of this variant.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 29, 2014, 04:21:15 AM
@rfielder - please let me know how you got on! Did you manage to set a static IP address for the computer you used to host the game and did you open a dedicated port for it as per MrNumbers' advice? If at least half the people in the league are able to host JCloisterZone games then it should be relatively simple for the other half to connect to them.
As stated in my message, I am playing between PCs on my home network.  No ports or static IPs needed.

You just need to know the IP of one of the PCs.  Running ipconfig in a text window will tell you the PC's IP address.

The sequence to start JCloister so that it talks to another PC can be tricky.  Annoyingly tricky.  Once you get the hang of it, is it OK, but...

Another annoyance is that JCloister does not have an install.  You get a .zip archive.  When you extract the files from the archive, you get the game only.  With no install routine, it will be far more of a challenge for many PC users.

The fact that there does not appear to be any documentation whatsoever raises the level of that challenge.  A lot.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on April 30, 2014, 03:16:48 AM
Hi all.

I have now received replies to all of the individual messages I sent out yesterday and will be emailing everyone again in the near future (hopefully today) with some final instructions/ guidance as to how I see things working. All being well, the league should be operational soon with the first round of matches scheduled to take place from next Monday (5th May).

@rfielder - hopefully any concerns you may have over the suitability of using JCloisterZone will be addressed in the email, but please do let me know if they're not  :)

Dan
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on April 30, 2014, 03:58:13 AM
Looking forward to it! After the first series is over, it would be great to do it again adding one expansion, then again with a different expansion etc.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on April 30, 2014, 06:43:27 AM
@rfielder - hopefully any concerns you may have over the suitability of using JCloisterZone will be addressed in the email, but please do let me know if they're not  :)
Dan:

I am sure JCloisterZone will be fine.

My only concern is getting it work between two individuals across the internet.  Has anyone here actually made that happen?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on April 30, 2014, 11:29:45 AM
Yes, this should be fun!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: AlbinoAsian on May 01, 2014, 01:04:26 AM
@rfielder - hopefully any concerns you may have over the suitability of using JCloisterZone will be addressed in the email, but please do let me know if they're not  :)
Dan:

I am sure JCloisterZone will be fine.

My only concern is getting it work between two individuals across the internet.  Has anyone here actually made that happen?

I suspect you'll have headaches with firewalls and port routing.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 01, 2014, 05:14:38 AM
My only concern is getting it work between two individuals across the internet.  Has anyone here actually made that happen?

Dan and I are doing a test run tonight to see if we can get it to work. We'll let you know how it goes!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 01, 2014, 05:17:56 AM
I just managed to get a game going between my work PC and my laptop at home. Unfortunately nobody was at home to actually play against but the two PCs spoke to each other and got as far as starting the game. This seems like good news.

I too was concerned about firewall problems but didn't have to make any changes to my firewall config at home to get things going, so hopefully this won't be an issue for anybody else either.

I have also produced a "short" document explaining how to setup internet games within JCloisterZone which I will be emailing out soon to everyone involved.

Looking forward to playing a few trial games against jungleboy tonight and possibly Rosco too in the near future!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on May 01, 2014, 06:07:23 AM
I wish you all good luck for your online game.

And I like to "hear" a report of the game...  ;)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Paul on May 01, 2014, 01:51:52 PM
Been following this thread, like every other to see how it goes.

Few days ago I finally downloaded this myself, and had to install the Java Runtime Environment which was no trouble at all. Tried a game on my own and it works pretty well.

Question: Can I pick up a tile recently placed or rotate it? Seems odd this is not imbedded with the right mouse click or wheel. Or, is this the drawback of Java itself?

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 01, 2014, 03:22:46 PM
I'm happy to report that JCloisterZone worked like a dream and jungleboy and I had two great games over the internet with no difficulties setting it up at all!

I've done a write-up of our first game - complete with screenshots - which can be found here:
http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=743.0

(I may well also write-up the second game but that was slightly longer as we included Inns & Cathedrals and Traders & Builders)

@Yellow - you can rotate tiles using the tab key or right-mouse button but once you've clicked to place it (and before you place a follower/ meeple) it can't be moved. I learnt this the hard way but it isn't often a big problem...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 04, 2014, 02:54:39 PM
Fixtures for Round 1 are as follows (check your email for more details):

Carcking vs danisthirty
jungleboy vs jvnoledawg
MrNumbers vs quevy
rfielder vs Rosco

Have fun!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on May 05, 2014, 09:12:26 AM
@Yellow - you can rotate tiles using the tab key or right-mouse button but once you've clicked to place it (and before you place a follower/ meeple) it can't be moved. I learnt this the hard way but it isn't often a big problem...
JCloisterZone really needs an Undo button.

For example, you place a tile, but have not placed a meeple.  Undo would allow you to move the tile elsewhere.

I have seen too many instances where the tile gets place accidentally, and you can't change it.  For example, if your opponent has captured one of your followers, and you click to redeem the follower BEFORE placing your next tile, the game will place the tile for you at a random spot.  That means the tile is stuck, and you just have to live with it.

We also had an instance where the game became nonresponsive.  And no, I do NOT mean no pulse and no pupil dilation!  :)   I mean that you click on things, and they would show movement, but you could not actually do anything.  We saved the game and exited.  Hopefully, we will have the time tonight to load that game and see if it now works.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 05, 2014, 01:06:52 PM
@rfielder - I know what you mean about the undo button. Best I can do is to point this out to the guy responsible for JCloisterZone and hopefully he will consider it for a future release.

The other two issues I haven't really experienced myself. Were you using any expansions when those problems occurred? I know that if you're playing with Traders & Builders and Princess & Dragon then the game seems to get confused if you place a dragon tile on a turn that should generate you a bonus turn through your builder. You do get the bonus turn after the dragon has been moved but it doesn't really let you play it and the game kind of stops (this has been reported). Saving and loading fixes this, but the score breakdown at the end of the game will only remember features scored since the load (final scores are unaffected).
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 08, 2014, 02:56:26 AM
Is there any League news? Have any other Round 1 matches been played or have the times for the matches been set yet? I presume there will be some sort of live video stream where we can all watch each match ;D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 08, 2014, 03:17:13 AM
None at present, although I'm very much looking forward to my match against CarcKing which is scheduled for midnight tonight (my time)! In the mean time I've been getting lots of practice in against the computer but it's not quite the same...

I've not heard anything from any of the others (MrNumbers, quevy, rfielder, Rosco) recently. How's it going guys? Please give me a shout if you need any assistance with hosting or anything else.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 09, 2014, 05:39:28 AM
Carcking and I had our match last night as planned. There were a few teething problems at first but we soon determined that these were down to the fact that CK was using an older version of JCloisterZone. Once we were both running the latest version (2.6) everything went very smoothly.

I won't describe the games in detail as I'm doing a write-up separately. In summary though, the first game could have gone either way. I felt like I had the edge after getting off to a good start and holding on to a narrow lead throughout most of the game. But I was lucky to get a third farmer onto the main farm (which had previously been tied) with the final tile and won by 120 to 98. At the halfway point I felt like the second game was going terribly as CK did such a great job of locking up my meeples from the start, but this turned out to be another win for me (albeit an undeserved one) by 120 to 113.

Looking forward to hearing about the other two matches so that we can establish the overall standings at the end of round 1!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 10, 2014, 07:26:11 AM
We just finished our two-game match with Quevy. Later I will write little report, now only facts:
I won both games: 123-79 and 83-69. My most used strategy was blocking the followers and trying to steal or at least share the feature.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on May 10, 2014, 07:36:22 AM
His strategy was successful winning the rematch aspect in the next league.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on May 10, 2014, 11:01:41 AM
MrNumbers is one of the best in his country...

I am happy to see, than you all have fun with the online game.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 10, 2014, 12:36:58 PM
I have posted my report (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=765.0).

His strategy was successful winning the rematch aspect in the next league.

I was trying to understand that you meant by that, but without luck.


Suggestion to moderators: maybe it is worth to create separate forum section the the League news and game reports?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 10, 2014, 01:27:47 PM
Congratulations on your match guys, hope you enjoyed it! Did you have any difficulty getting the network game to work?

Now we just need rfielder and Rosco to have their match and then we'll be ready to move on to the next round...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 10, 2014, 02:26:45 PM
Did you have any difficulty getting the network game to work?

No difficulties at all! It works just as I described earlier: I have changed the port of the game, set up port forwarding in the router and that's it!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on May 10, 2014, 02:51:59 PM
I have posted my report (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=765.0).

His strategy was successful winning the rematch aspect in the next league.

I was trying to understand that you meant by that, but without luck.


Suggestion to moderators: maybe it is worth to create separate forum section the the League news and game reports?

His strategy was successful winning. I wait for the rematch in the next league.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 10, 2014, 03:15:59 PM
His strategy was successful winning. I wait for the rematch in the next league.

Ok, now I got this :) I am sure that there will be a rematch >:D ;D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on May 10, 2014, 03:29:52 PM
...
Suggestion to moderators: maybe it is worth to create separate forum section the the League news and game reports?
It's a great idea - but that is work for our admins.

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 10, 2014, 03:42:20 PM
I have finally written the report for my match against Carcking earlier in the week!

It can be found here:

http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=766.0
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Andrew the Ambo on May 12, 2014, 05:44:42 PM
Is it possible to get a guide on how to set up an Internet game for dummies?  Do you need a fixed IP address?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 12, 2014, 09:43:10 PM
Hi Andrew,

If you PM me your email address I can send you a short guide I put together but the basics are:

- One player per game needs to be the host. The other players connect to the host by entering the host's IP address and a port number
- The host needs to have a static IP address configured for their PC/ laptop/ whatever through their DHCP settings on their home network
- The host also needs to setup port forwarding to that IP in order for the other players to connect to them. The default port for JCloisterZone is 37447 (this is the one I configured)
- To start a game, the host must open JCloisterZone and wait on the pre-game screen for the other players to connect
- To connect to the host, remote players click "Connect" and enter the host's external IP and port number
- The order in which the players connect and assign themselves a colour/ enter their player name determines the play order
- Once all players have connected (this doesn't have to include the host, so technically a third player could host a two-player game for two remotely connected players) you click New Game and off you go!
- In my experience so far, everything should be OK as long as all players are using the same version of JCloisterZone (current version is 2.6)

The most complicated bit is setting up the fixed IP and port forwarding but because that's done on the router it varies from router to router so there's no way of explaining how to do this in detail.

Hope this helps!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on May 12, 2014, 10:39:09 PM
Dan - can you host for us tonight at about 9.30 gmt? I tried but I cannot get a static ip.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 12, 2014, 11:52:18 PM
Hi Rosco, yes that's no problem at all. I'll email you both the connection details and make sure I'm standing by at 9:30 GMT.

Good luck to both of you, I hope the game goes well for you!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 13, 2014, 09:04:24 AM
Since the league seems to have generated a bit of interest in how JCloisterZone can be used to play Carcassonne online I have posted the documentation I wrote for it on the forums here:

http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=778.0

Even if you're not taking part in the league, hopefully this will help you towards getting your own online games going!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on May 13, 2014, 03:04:07 PM
Just finished our games - 1 each - we were well matched i think!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on May 14, 2014, 01:56:13 AM
Hi all,
I don't really have time for a full review but a  quick one is in order.

Game 1.
The first game started with a cloister for me and quickly followed with me getting almost all of them.  the scores were pretty much even throughout the game however a battle ensued for ownership of an enormous city which Rfielder won. I thought all was lost as he also had control of the main farm but I managed to get in on it, however in the last few tiled my esteemed opponent connected another farmer and blocked all possibilities of a win for me. Robert played well!

Game 2
Our second game started in almost exactly the same manor as the first but in reverse. Some lucky tile draws and fighting placements got me an early lead. I kept the lead, blocking Robert's cities, and dominated the farm from start to finish although Robert fought well.

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 14, 2014, 02:37:17 AM
Well done everyone!

Round 1 is now complete so here are the current standings (as I see them) going into Round 2 (please let me know if you think I've made any mistakes):

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_round_1_breakdown.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_standings_at_end_of_round_1.jpg)

I don't think these mean very much at the moment as we're at such an early stage, and I'm expecting things to change dramatically over the next couple of rounds (certainly in my case anyway)! Congratulations to everyone involved for enabling the league to get off the ground. I'm already enjoying it immensely and I've only played one match! I hope you are too...

So without further ado, here are the fixtures for Round 2:

Carcking vs jungleboy
danisthirty vs jvnoledawg
MrNumbers vs rfielder
quevy vs Rosco

As before, please arrange your matches by email ensuring that both players get to start in one game each (start player determined by order of connection rather than colour - sorry for any confusion). Let me know your scores (via screenshots if possible) so that I can update the overall scores, and feel free to post a write-up of your match in the "Reviews & Session Reports" section if you're able to, linking to it from this thread.

If neither you nor your opponent is able to host a game please let me know when you've arranged to play and I'll happily host it for you.

Let's go!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 14, 2014, 04:44:49 AM
Great stuff Dan, thanks again for all your work.

I definitely need to pick up all three points this round to catch up with the leaders!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: evmillan on May 14, 2014, 04:47:32 AM
Great report danisthirty!

Some Sports Channels are looking for people to manage the stats in the World Cup.  :))
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 14, 2014, 05:28:55 AM
@jungleboy - I think Carcking may have something to say about that! I'm sure it will be an excellent match...

@evmillan - if it was a Carcassonne World Cup I'd be only too happy to! I love the idea of lots of experts sitting round a table commentating on tile placements, general tactics and blocking opportunities etc:

"Now this is an interesting tile placement as he's leaving Joe with an opportunity to finish his city here in favour of getting a second farmer of his own onto the main farm! How do you think that's likely to play out Nick?"

"Well, it could go either way. Technically the odds are in his favour but he could be playing a dangerous game here if Joe draws the tile he needs before he does. Both players will be only too well aware that with just 15 tiles left in the bag it's certainly risky at this stage..."
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on May 14, 2014, 10:01:11 AM
I definitely need to pick up all three points this round to catch up with the leaders!

haha - not if I have anything to say about it! ;)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on May 14, 2014, 10:31:18 AM
I'd like to join the next tournament when the current one will be over. Let me know! (In the meantime, if you play on iOS, feel free to challenge me! Just send me a private msg.)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 15, 2014, 02:06:11 AM
Hi Jere, it would be great to have you on board!

Since we're only on the 2nd of 7 rounds at present it's difficult to say when the current league will finish. All being well, I think it will either have finished or be near completion towards the end of next month. Based on how much fun it's already been I'm hoping there will be enough interest to kick off another league very soon after that, and will be sure to contact you about it at the time.

Until then, I recommend downloading JCloisterZone (http://jcloisterzone.com/en/) and getting used to it. The AI opponents aren't bad, but if you wanted to get some practise in against some real opponents I'm sure that most of the people taking part in the current league (myself included) would be more than happy to play against you.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 18, 2014, 06:08:34 AM
For better communication between League participants regarding playing games through different time zones, question arises how to know exact time difference between two players (time zones, DST, etc.). There are many websites that show time in other cities and countries, I just chose one: http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/ (http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/)
Hope this helps someone to easier manage their matches.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 18, 2014, 09:13:42 AM
We had good match with Robert (rfielder) today. After persistent struggle I won both games: 113-77 and 117-72. Later I will try to write a small review (if rfielder won't do it faster).
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on May 19, 2014, 06:18:57 AM
MrNumbers vs rfielder:

We played.

He won, very convincingly.

Good games!

Amazing technology.  We are almost 7,000km apart, Brampton to Riga, and 7 hours apart.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 20, 2014, 04:09:44 AM
So it looks like Mr Numbers has emerged as the big star in this competition so far. The Martins Dukurs of Carcassonne :)

(For those who don't know, Martins Dukurs is a star Latvian skeleton athlete and I believe Mr Numbers is also Latvian.)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 20, 2014, 06:52:50 AM
I believe Mr Numbers is also Latvian.

Technically I am Latvian: I was born in Riga (when it was in USSR) and live here all the time, I have Latvian citizenship and I perfectly know Latvian language. But my native language is Russian and I have nationality "Russian" in my passport.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 20, 2014, 07:20:03 AM
Technically I am Latvian: I was born in Riga (when it was in USSR) and live here all the time, I have Latvian citizenship and I perfectly know Latvian language. But my native language is Russian and I have nationality "Russian" in my passport.

Thanks for letting us know! In this case you can be the Alex Ovechkin or Alexander Tretiakov of Carcassonne :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on May 20, 2014, 11:27:47 AM
jungleboy, thank you for the compliment! ^-^
But our League just started and everything can happen :D
See you on our match! ;)

By the way, I have written a report (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=795.0) for our match with rfielder.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 20, 2014, 02:10:43 PM
It is early days indeed, but I for one am nervous about playing MrNumbers...

(this said, I'm nervous about playing everyone even though I keep reminding myself that it's all just for fun!)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 22, 2014, 02:54:34 PM
jvnoledawg and I have just had our match; it's amazing how different two games can be!

The first game was very one-sided and ended up being won by me by 114 points to 40:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round2_jvnoledawg_Game1_Scores.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round2_jvnoledawg_Game1_Map.jpg)

The second game felt entirely different. After getting off to a good start and bagging a few early points, Joe built a lead of ten points over me and as the game progressed I simply couldn't claw any of them back. We ended up sharing almost everything including one large city and two farms, and Joe finished ten points ahead (134 - 124) to make our match a draw...

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round2_jvnoledawg_Game2_Scores.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round2_jvnoledawg_Game2_Map.jpg)

Looking forward to hearing news of the other two matches? Anything to report guys?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 22, 2014, 11:21:40 PM
That's exactly what dawg did to me in our first-round match: he lulls you into a false sense of security with a poor first game, then comes back strongly to snatch a draw by winning the second game! Interesting strategy :)

I hope to play my match with Carcking this weekend if we can sort out the time difference.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 23, 2014, 12:01:39 AM
Crafty. He's definitely one to watch out for!

It's never nice when you can tell your opponent is having a horrible time, and I felt almost guilty that all my tiles seemed to be coming up whereas his weren't. I must admit, I thought the match was going to be another win for me after the first game but Joe clearly had other ideas!

Good luck to both of you for the weekend. It's only the second round but I'm already very keen to see how the overall standings are going to look once all of the matches have taken place.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Scott on May 24, 2014, 07:36:11 AM
Suggestion to moderators: maybe it is worth to create separate forum section the the League news and game reports?

Agreed and done! I've set up danisthirty as a moderator for this new forum, since he seems to be in charge of running the league.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on May 24, 2014, 10:41:32 AM
I have now Ipad, I can make my games there as well.
Appearance response from rosco email to when and how to play.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on May 25, 2014, 10:04:11 PM
Suggestion to moderators: maybe it is worth to create separate forum section the the League news and game reports?

Agreed and done! I've set up danisthirty as a moderator for this new forum, since he seems to be in charge of running the league.
Congratulations to you danishirty,
 to your new stats as a moderator.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 27, 2014, 08:28:52 AM
Thanks kettlefish!

I'm sure that this will make things much easier with regard to keeping the forum neat and tidy.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 29, 2014, 05:37:11 AM
Hi all.

It's so cool that we've been given our own dedicated area of the forums especially for our league so thanks very much to Scott for that (and thanks to MrNumbers for suggesting it). It feels a bit like walking into a newly built house and planning where all the furniture's going to go at the moment, so please let me know if you have any ideas for how we can kit our new pad out!

Firstly, an update on round 2 which is now finished. Almost. quevy and Rosco are yet to face each other but I thought it would be best to postpone this match at their convenience (play it whenever you can guys!) and begin round 3 so that the rest of us can keep playing. As such, the standings below are incomplete and are subject to change but I've included them anyway and hopefully they can be completed soon:


(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_standings_at_end_of_round_2.jpg)
(overall league standings at end of round 2 [quevy and Rosco are one match behind everyone else])

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_round_2_breakdown.jpg)
(results of round 2 matches)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_average_game_scores_end_round_2.jpg)
(calculation of average scores)


Anyway, the main reason for this post is to announce the fixtures for round 3 of the league, so here they are:


Match 1: Carcking vs. jvnoledawg (same time zone)

Match 2: danisthirty vs. jungleboy (one hour time difference)

Match 3: MrNumbers vs. Rosco (two hour time difference)

Match 4: rfielder vs. quevy (6 hours time difference)


Good luck to everyone - apart from jungleboy ;) - I'm really looking forward to seeing how this round affects the overall standings and reading the post-match reports afterwards.

One final note; there's a small surprise in store for round 4 which will hopefully make it the most exciting round so far, but I'll explain more about this when we get there...

Let the battle(s) commence!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on May 29, 2014, 06:22:55 AM
Great stuff Dan. One suggestion for the overall table: perhaps you could add a 'Played' column before the 'Won' column which would help us see more easily which players haven't played all their matches yet.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on May 29, 2014, 08:32:39 AM
Nicely done Dan!

Also, in the players' score table try to include scores allowed by player...just for a bit extra stat tracking.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on May 29, 2014, 09:01:41 AM
@jungleboy - thanks for the suggestion. I've added this as a new column to the overall league standings chart.

@Carcking - thanks but I'm not entirely sure I understand what you mean by "scores allowed by player". Do you mean like, points scored AGAINST each person in addition to tracking points scored BY each person? I can certainly see the value in this although it may be a hassle to maintain...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on May 29, 2014, 10:16:06 AM
@Carcking - thanks but I'm not entirely sure I understand what you mean by "scores allowed by player". Do you mean like, points scored AGAINST each person in addition to tracking points scored BY each person? I can certainly see the value in this although it may be a hassle to maintain...

If I lose a game 99 to 96, I have allowed 99 points to be scored against me. It's perhaps a measure of a player's defense, so to speak. As I say, not necessary but with time it will reveal trends.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jvnoledawg on May 29, 2014, 11:54:54 AM
Although I appreciate the complements, I can assure you I am NOT using a rope-a-dope strategy!  (Google it if you don't know boxing.)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 02, 2014, 10:05:51 AM
Quevy vs. rfielder

Game 1
119 - 78

Game 2
117 - 116

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 02, 2014, 10:20:27 AM
One point! Amazing how often this happens in Carcassonne  :gray-meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 02, 2014, 10:28:39 AM
A tile lucky in the end. if I did not take that many points were for him more.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 02, 2014, 06:09:15 PM
I'm curious. Who went first in that second game?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 02, 2014, 10:59:59 PM
I'm first in the first game, Robert first in the second, in the second not it's possible placed the tile cccc, it's eliminated, I'm placed the final tile.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 03, 2014, 04:24:35 PM
Jungleboy and I have had our round 3 match and I'm pleased to announce that it was a hard-fought 2 - 0 victory to me!

Write-up can be found here:
http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=813
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 07, 2014, 12:50:45 PM
Any more action in the league this weekend?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 07, 2014, 01:00:58 PM
Don't look now but I've heard there's a crazy rumour going round that Rosco, MrNumbers and Quevy may all be playing this evening! Stay tuned for details coming soon hopefully...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 07, 2014, 04:26:20 PM
No news for now, unfortunately :-\ On Wednesday I have asked Rosco for appropriate time for a match, but no respond so far...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 08, 2014, 10:06:00 AM
Quevy - Rosco

Game 1 133-112 
Game 2 116-108 (I have not had time to do the screenshots and I'm not sure, he did rosco)

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on June 08, 2014, 10:25:27 AM
I would like to apologise to everyone in the league that i have been really crap at keeping in contact.  It is because we have been moving house from spain to the uk and we still dont have internet.  we have to go to my parents house for internet!  trust me it is more frustrating for me than for you.

i hope to be fully online within the next week.

Mr numbers - i will be available one day next week to play - let me know one evening you can play.

I have been emailing by the way but i guess my emails might have gone to junk.

Sorry again people.

Ross
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 08, 2014, 10:43:39 AM
As you have seen we played on Facebook, in the first game we had a hard time with too low and we lost a few rounds.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 08, 2014, 11:18:13 AM
Not good day for Rosco today:
MrNumbers - Rosco
Game 1 - 106:70.
Game 2 - 113:74.

BTW, Rosco has a good tactics, almost everything was placed in a way I would placed. Rosco even has stolen 36-point city from me!
But I won the battle for the farms in both games (24-3, 36-3) and this was critical. Detailed report (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=823.0) is ready.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 08, 2014, 01:22:04 PM
Quevy, we need to play a trial game someday :) As I can see after our match you didn't loose a single game! :D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 08, 2014, 01:48:10 PM
Guys, thanks so much for your efforts in getting the league back on track! With just one match left to be played I'm hoping that the next round will be the best yet...

@Rosco - Thanks for your post. I hope the move is going smoothly. Whereabouts in the UK are you moving to?

@quevy - How did your match on Facebook compare to JCloisterZone? I can only see 69 tiles in your screenshot so I'm guessing the 3 missing tiles were discarded because of time-outs? That is one disadvantage with playing over Facebook, but I believe the time-out interval can be set anywhere from 10 seconds to 90 seconds when you start the game...

@MrNumbers - Your unbeaten role has continued! Very impressive.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 08, 2014, 02:16:19 PM
@quevy - How did your match on Facebook compare to JCloisterZone? I can only see 69 tiles in your screenshot so I'm guessing the 3 missing tiles were discarded because of time-outs? That is one disadvantage with playing over Facebook, but I believe the time-out interval can be set anywhere from 10 seconds to 90 seconds when you start the game...

Yes, exactly 3 tiles missing, the first was lost by rosco, I have to equalize immediately allowed the time of my time, unfortunately after I was distracted by my son and I missed a tile. In the second game we increased the time to 1 minute and we did not find any problems.

Quevy, we need to play a trial game someday :) As I can see after our match you didn't loose a single game! :D

Ok :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 08, 2014, 02:44:08 PM
danisthirty,
do we get an update of your table lists?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 08, 2014, 10:47:09 PM
@quevy - I have lost many tiles in the same way because my children have distracted me too! It looks like it was quite a close match though, who started which games?

@kettlefish - yes absolutely, we just need to wait to see what happens in the carcking vs jvnoledawg match. Hopefully this should be taking place either today or tomorrow and I will update the stats and post them here as soon as that happens.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 09, 2014, 12:05:01 PM
danisthirty,
do we get an update of your table lists?

I'd prefer not to see an updated version myself :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 09, 2014, 12:08:56 PM
@quevy - I have lost many tiles in the same way because my children have distracted me too! It looks like it was quite a close match though, who started which games?


In the first game rosco started, in the second I was the first.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 11, 2014, 03:23:05 AM
Hello.

A massive thanks and a pat on the back for everyone for your involvement so far. I hope you're enjoying taking part in the league as much as I am, and are all set for an epic fourth round (more on this below). First though, here's a somewhat detailed look at the way things are at the moment starting with a round-up of all the round-3 action:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_round_3_breakdown.png)

Wins all round (for half of us)! And not a draw in sight...

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_standings_at_end_of_round_3.png)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_average_game_scores_end_round_3.png)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_average_game_scores_against_end_round_3.png)

(thanks for the suggestions I've had regarding stats I should be tracking, if you can think of anything else please let me know and I'll add it to my ever-growing spreadsheet and end-of-round summaries)

As you can see, MrNumbers is still at the top! In fact as well as being unbeaten, the most anyone has scored against him in a single game is 79 (the least is 69, average is 73.5). Defensively, this makes him the most consistent player of all of us, but whether he can hold on to his impressive track record remains to be seen. With 4 rounds to go there are still plenty of points to be won and I firmly believe that anyone could finish anywhere at this point so let's bring it on!

As some of you may or may not have noticed, the league so far has actually been run as two "mini-leagues" of 4-players each. These mini-leagues were organised alphabetically with Carcking, myself, jungleboy and jvnoledawg forming the first group and MrNumbers, quevy, rfielder and Rosco forming the second. Now that we've reached the end of round 3, both mini-leagues are complete meaning that players in each group can be ranked from first to fourth as shown below:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_mini_league_final_scores.png)

Ultimately, our positions in each of these mini-leagues won't have any impact on our final position in the overall league. But what this does mean is that we can now play our same-ranked opposite numbers between the two mini-leagues for our round 4 fixtures. I'm hoping that this will lead to some very close and competitive matches, and I'm particularly looking forward to facing MrNumbers as a result!

So, fixtures for round 4 are as follows:

Match 1: danisthirty vs. MrNumbers (3-hour time difference)
Match 2: Carcking vs. quevy (6-hour time difference)
Match 3: jungleboy vs. Rosco (same time zone)
Match 4: jvnoledawg vs. rfielder (same time zone)

Good luck everyone!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 11, 2014, 04:21:34 AM
This round will be VERY interesting, in any case - for me :D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 11, 2014, 04:59:55 AM
I'm hoping it will be a very interesting round for everyone MrNumbers, but I can't deny that I am especially looking forward to our match!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 11, 2014, 08:34:11 AM
Finally I switched to ranked third, are in recovery.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 11, 2014, 12:27:38 PM
@quevy - the best time for us to play will probably be on Saturday June 21st. Sometime in the morning for me will be sometime in the afternoon for you. Something like that.

During the week days I can play around 6pm but that will be Midnight for you.

What day and time is good for you?

Carcking
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 11, 2014, 01:37:23 PM
Phenomenal work Dan!  :red-meeple: :meeple: :green-meeple: :blue-meeple: :black-meeple: :gray-meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 12, 2014, 08:52:47 AM
@quevy - the best time for us to play will probably be on Saturday June 21st. Sometime in the morning for me will be sometime in the afternoon for you. Something like that.

During the week days I can play around 6pm but that will be Midnight for you.

What day and time is good for you?

Carcking
I think that hour for me to be able to go well, unfortunately I do not know the shifts of my wife, if I have to watch my son does not think I can play.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 12, 2014, 10:12:36 AM
@quevy - the best time for us to play will probably be on Saturday June 21st. Sometime in the morning for me will be sometime in the afternoon for you. Something like that.

During the week days I can play around 6pm but that will be Midnight for you.

What day and time is good for you?

Carcking
I think that hour for me to be able to go well, unfortunately I do not know the shifts of my wife, if I have to watch my son does not think I can play.

Ok, just let me know what is the best day and time for you and we'll see if it can work.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 13, 2014, 02:32:16 PM
MrNumbers and I have just had our match. He is an insanely good player! But, I got lucky in the first game (the last tile was a very good one for me) so wasn't too bothered that I got totally outplayed in the second and was happy to settle on a draw. I will add a write-up of the first game soon, and MrNumbers will do the same thing for the second game tomorrow.

Is anybody else expecting to play soon?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 13, 2014, 06:09:49 PM
Is anybody else expecting to play soon?
I am communicating with jvnoledawg for our game.   He indicated that this weekend is a possibility, and I am just waiting to hear back as to when.

Beign the low man on the totem pole/leaderboard just means I have place to go but up!

Or sideways.

Or no movement at all.....

Never mind!  Now, where's my beer.....

:)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 14, 2014, 12:55:25 AM
Well done Dan! The first person to take a game from MrNumbers so far! You're on a roll.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 14, 2014, 04:44:52 AM
I've got some surprisings... perhaps for the winner of your CarcC League...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 14, 2014, 08:42:58 AM
The Top rated stopped each other, the third in the standings can not but rejoice :)

I've got some surprisings... perhaps for the winner of your CarcC League...
Wow Marion :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 17, 2014, 07:02:34 AM
I have switched around a couple of the round 4 fixtures such that jungleboy will now be playing rfielder and jvnoledawg will face Rosco.

The jungleboy vs rfielder match is scheduled to take place tonight (more from rfielder on this soon I believe) and there's a chance that Carcking vs quevy may also be happening this week (@quevy - please check your email).

Best of luck to everyone involved!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 17, 2014, 12:34:01 PM
I've called with Moritz Brunnhofer (HiG) today.
He will send some tiles to Klaus-Juergen Wrede for signing the tiles...  ;D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 17, 2014, 12:57:52 PM
That's fantastic, thanks so much kettlefish!   :) :) :) :) :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 18, 2014, 02:03:35 AM
Dan, just a small suggestion about the standings. The played/won/lost section refers to individual games, not 'matches' of two games, so this can create some apparent anomalies with the standings.

For example, two players can both have the same line: Played: 4, won 2, lost 2, but one can have three points (by winning one match 2-0 and losing the other match 0-2) and the other can have two points (by splitting both matches 1-1).

To take this further, if one player played six matches (12 games), winning three matches and losing three matches, they would have a win-loss record of 6-6 and nine total points. Another player could play six matches, winning one of them and drawing the other five. This person would then have a better win-loss record of 7-5, but only eight total points (5x1 + 3).

All of this is a way of saying that I think we should include match results as well as game results, in the standings, to make it clearer how each player ended up with the number of points they have.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 18, 2014, 02:44:53 AM
It's funny you should say that as I was just agonising over the current standings and was trying to anticipate how they might change depending on various outcomes. My case in point being that if the Carcking vs quevy match results in a win for quevy then he will have 9 points from 3 match wins and 1 match loss. This will put him one point ahead of me as I have 8 points from 2 match wins and 2 match draws. In terms of games though, we'll be even as we'll both have won 6 and lost 2, so I was thinking about that a little bit.

In any case, I have updated the spreadsheet now as per your suggestion. It's looking pretty good for those among us who like numbers and statistics (see photo below)! Speaking of which, here are some of the interesting game achievements I've been tracking so far:

Highest Losing Score: 124 (danisthirty lost by 10 points to jvnoledawg)
Lowest Winning Score: 83 (MrNumbers won by 14 points against quevy)
Closest Game: 117 - 116 (quevy/ rfielder - quevy won by 1 point)
Biggest Score Difference: 114 - 40 (danisthirty/ jvnoledawg - danisthirty won by 74 points)
Highest combined scores: 258 (danisthirty/ jvnoledawg - jvnoledawg won by 10 points)

Please let me know if you can think of any other similar achievements that could be recorded!

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/CurrentLeagueStanding_18jun14.jpg)

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 18, 2014, 07:50:48 AM
Thanks danisthirty,
now I do understand the League Points.   ;D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 18, 2014, 07:59:11 AM
You need to resort by league points so that I am ahead of Carcking :)

(I realise, of course, that I have played one more match.)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 18, 2014, 08:10:58 AM
@kettlefish - I'm sorry it wasn't clear, I'm glad that the leader board makes sense now :)

@jungleboy - maybe it's just me, but I have trouble getting Excel to sort the table without messing up all the formatting and mixing everyone's average scores up. I find it easier just to do it by hand, but because this takes a few minutes at a time I tend to wait until I've got all the results in before I do it.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 18, 2014, 08:24:23 AM
I call sabotage! :red-meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 18, 2014, 10:32:16 AM
@danisthirty...the check is in the mail ;)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 21, 2014, 07:37:28 AM
Carcking, your game has stopped, has something happened?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 21, 2014, 07:45:24 AM
Carcking, your game has stopped, has something happened?

Have you guys seen any of my emails??
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 21, 2014, 08:32:10 AM
Landslide victory of Carcking, suspend the first game made me lose concentration.
I have not counted my followers and I was no one, even though I thought I had one more...
It would be enough to move the gaze of a few centimeters to notice...
I was too caught up in the game.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 21, 2014, 08:40:19 AM
I was connected to your very first game as a spectator and saw everything till it get frozen. Maybe spectators cause games to freeze?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 21, 2014, 08:49:53 AM
Perhaps this is possible.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 21, 2014, 10:20:53 AM
Quevy-Carcking 69-104
Carcking-Quevy 72-101

The rankings remain unchanged. Dan can breathe a sigh of relief.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 21, 2014, 04:40:35 PM
@quevy - I can indeed, but there are still at least two more rounds to go and you and I haven't faced each other yet!  :)

It seems strange that in both games the starting player lost. I normally view starting as being a slight advantage but clearly this wasn't the case here!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 21, 2014, 06:59:48 PM
It seems strange that in both games the starting player lost. I normally view starting as being a slight advantage but clearly this wasn't the case here!
As the keeper of statistics, only YOU can tell - who wins most often?  Those who go first?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 23, 2014, 03:10:06 AM
So that's another round successfully completed! Kind of...

You may have noticed that I changed a couple of the fixtures in this round owing to difficulties experienced by jvnoledawg and Rosco. At present I don't know whether either will play any future part in this league but obviously I'm hopeful that they will and will continue to do my best to support them and enable them to take part in any outstanding matches. In order to keep things moving for the rest of us though, we will continue with rounds 5 and 6 such that the six of us who remain will have played each other plus either jvnoledawg (Carcking, jungleboy and I) or Rosco (MrNumbers, quevy and rfielder). Hopefully this makes sense and everyone can appreciate why this is necessary at this stage (but do please let me know if you have any alternative ideas!)

So without any further ado, here are the standings at the end of round 4:


(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_round_4_breakdown.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_standings_at_end_of_round_4_update.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_average_game_scores_end_round_4.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/ccl_average_game_scores_against_end_round_4.jpg)


As you can see, MrNumbers is refusing to give up the top spot and remains there for the third round in a row. But anything other than a win for him in the next round could be good news for me if my next two games end in my favour! Quevy meanwhile is still nipping at my heels in third after drawing against Carcking who now lies in fifth as jungleboy moves up to fourth! But there's not much between them as they both have 5 league points, with jungleboy ahead on average game score by just 0.38 points (811 points from 8 games as opposed to 808)! Finally, r-"caged lion"-fielder is still waiting for that all-important win to put him ahead of jvnoledawg and Rosco and is becoming an increasingly dangerous opponent as he does so! So, there's still everything to play for with just two rounds to go...

I've arranged round 5 so that one person in each pair will be able to host the match. I'm hoping this will make it quite a quick round as I'm aware that jungleboy isn't going to be available for a month from 11th July so will need to get his remaining matches in before then (I too will be away from next Monday although this will only be for a week):

Carcking vs rfielder (host) - same time zone
danisthirty (host) vs quevy - 1 hour time difference
jungleboy vs MrNumbers (host) - 1 hour time difference

Please post your results back here when you're finished and I'll log them...

Good luck all!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 23, 2014, 07:57:04 AM
Thanks again Dan. Can you just double check the details in the Games columns? Shouldn't Carcking and quevy be on 8 games played and not 6?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 23, 2014, 08:51:51 AM
You're quite right Nick, I was a bit excited this morning as I was putting the "end of round summary" together and completely missed this. I'll replace it now...
Title: Carcassonne League Round 5
Post by: rfielder on June 23, 2014, 09:28:27 AM
Carcking vs rfielder on Wed June 25 @ 1830hrs EST, rfielder hosting.

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 23, 2014, 09:38:20 AM
Wow, you organised that quickly!

Good luck both, I'm sure it'll be a great match!  :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 23, 2014, 01:13:33 PM
MrNumbers and I just played our 5th round match! MrNumbers won the first game 94-72 and I won the second game 125-119. Reports to come soon!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 23, 2014, 01:19:01 PM
Wow, I look forward to reading how they evolved games.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 23, 2014, 01:20:11 PM
Wow and double wow! That 2nd game must have been epic! I can't believe you scored 125 against MrNumbers; that's a full lap of the scoretrack above the average number of points that he normally allows!

Well done for getting yourselves organised so quickly, that's amazing! And well done for getting a draw too jungleboy, I can't wait to read the reports...

With any luck, quevy and I shall be playing tomorrow and Carcking vs rfielder on Wednesday. This may be the quickest round yet; we could even be finished by the end of the week!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 23, 2014, 10:46:16 PM
You owe me one Dan, I just kept your chance for top spot alive!  :green-meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 23, 2014, 11:28:07 PM
Indeed, albeit only a slim one as I've left myself with a bit of a mountain to climb! If I beat quevy and score at least 184 points in the process (92 per game) then I can take the lead. Then there's the small matter of keeping it! I imagine quevy is going to do everything he can to stop this from happening.

A win for quevy in our match will leave me in third, or possibly even fourth or fifth (depending on scores and Carcking/ rfielder) so there's still everything to play for...

This is all getting rather exciting!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 24, 2014, 02:19:14 PM
My dreams of glory shattered ...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 24, 2014, 02:24:00 PM
I've just played my round 5 match with Quevy. The final result was a 2 - 0 win to me! Game scores below:

Game 1 started by danisthirty
danisthirty:   110
Quevy:      76

Game 2 started by Quevy
Quevy:      81
danisthirty:   98

The first game felt a little one-sided as I was given a lot of very favourable tiles. The second was a lot closer and although I finished 17 points ahead it felt a lot closer and I didn't know who was going to win...

Sorry quevy  :(
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 24, 2014, 02:26:21 PM
Every defeat by way of learning something, this evening I learned a lot ;)  :(y)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 24, 2014, 02:30:06 PM
It's a pity that you didn't win, quevy :-\ That meens I am not on the first place anymore :(
But we still have the last round, Dan! >:D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 24, 2014, 02:44:36 PM
The difference in experience is too much, do too many stupid mistakes  ;D.
If Carcking not won two games I remain third.
Rooting for Rfielder tomorrow night :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 24, 2014, 11:28:51 PM
Carcking still has to play MrNumbers and quevy and I still have to play each other. So I think the three of us could be very close at the end!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 25, 2014, 01:16:09 AM
At the moment I wouldn't guess 1st/2nd or 3rd/4th/5th as it's just too close!

Here is my write-up of the match I had with Quevy:

http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=851
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 26, 2014, 05:25:06 AM
Has the Carcking v rfielder match taken place yet?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 26, 2014, 06:14:55 AM
Has the Carcking v rfielder match taken place yet?
Yes.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 26, 2014, 06:15:18 AM
Has the Carcking v rfielder match taken place yet?
He won.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 26, 2014, 07:53:00 AM
@jungleboy - yes it has, making this the quickest round so far! Here's a more detailed look at what's happened over the last couple of days:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r5_breakdown-1.jpg)

(apologies for taking so long to put this post-round update together but I didn't get the results of the Carcking vs rfielder match as early as I'd hoped so had to update the spreadsheet at work and this has coincided somewhat awkwardly with a particularly busy day)

Anyway, here's something more interesting:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r5_overall_standings.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r5_rank_by_attack.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r5_rank_by_defence.jpg)

Obviously this has been a huge round, and with just one more to come I've reached my peak level of excitement (I hope). Fixtures for the final round are below:

Match 1: Carcking vs MrNumbers - 7 hour time difference (Host: MrNumbers)
Match 2: danisthirty vs rfielder - 5 hour time difference (Host: either)
Match 3: jungleboy vs quevy - same time zone (Host: to be arranged)

Surprisingly, what had rapidly been turning into a one-horse race could potentially be won by one of three people:

- A win for MrNumbers in match 1 combined with a draw or a loss for danisthirty in match 2 would mean overall victory for MrNumbers
- A win for Carcking in match 1 combined with a loss for danisthirty in match 2 could mean overall victory for Carcking (depending on average scores)
- A win for danisthirty in match 2 combined with a draw or a loss for MrNumbers in match 1 would mean overall victory for danisthirty

In short, nothing has been settled yet so there's still everything to play for.

Good luck everyone!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 26, 2014, 09:09:26 AM
Gah! How important is my mistake in our second game now Dan? Boy, I wish I had that one back  O0

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 26, 2014, 09:13:55 AM
Indeed. A lot of deeply sub-conscious psychological pressuring was involved in forcing you to make that mistake. I'm so glad I did it...  :)

In truth I have thought about that on several occasions too. Funny how a single tile placement can be key to an entire league (from my perspective anyway)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 26, 2014, 09:26:39 AM
For the first and third scenarios you posted Dan (regarding you and MrNumbers), a draw by the first player mentioned combined with a loss by the second player mentioned would also be enough to see the first player mentioned win the league.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 26, 2014, 09:30:22 AM
That's true jungleboy, but it got really complicated trying to word it that way so I decided to try and keep things simple. Ultimately, if MrNumbers and I don't score the same number of league points from this round then one of us will win. Even if we do both score the same number of points, if it's a draw or a win then one of us will win. If we both lose then it will come down to a 3-way tie with Carcking and whoever has the highest average score will win.

At this rate I'm not going to be able to concentrate on actually playing Carcassonne as I'll have too many of these statistics flying around my head!  :o
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 26, 2014, 09:45:33 AM
In truth I have thought about that on several occasions too. Funny how a single tile placement can be key to an entire league (from my perspective anyway)
Tell me about it!

I lost one earlier game by 1 point, and ONLY because my opponent had the last tile, and he drew the perfect tile!  To add insult to injury, my opponent had the last tile only because the game had rejected one tile earlier.

No issues with losing, but sometimes you realize how much depends on luck!

Or the lack thereof, and I strive to prove.  Repeatedly.   ;)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 26, 2014, 09:47:32 AM
If a tie is the ultimate result, will there be a play off?

And if there is a play off, can we try opening it up to anyone who wishes to watch?

I won't volunteer to host, because my setup seems less than stable, but if someone who has not encountered issues while hosting games would allow, it could be interesting....
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 26, 2014, 09:53:11 AM
If it's a tie in terms of league points, it will be decided on average score. If it's a tie on average score as well then I don't know what we'll do, but thankfully that seems quite unlikely. Maybe we'd have to have a high-stakes, winner-takes-all final showdown?!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 26, 2014, 10:08:03 AM
Indeed. A lot of deeply sub-conscious psychological pressuring was involved in forcing you to make that mistake. I'm so glad I did it...  :)

Yes, a well played strategy for sure!  :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on June 26, 2014, 10:15:24 AM
If it's a tie in terms of league points, it will be decided on average score. If it's a tie on average score as well then I don't know what we'll do, but thankfully that seems quite unlikely. Maybe we'd have to have a high-stakes, winner-takes-all final showdown?!
How about a best of seven series?  Played alternating days, to keep it moving.

<grin>
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 26, 2014, 03:47:38 PM
Hey guys,

I was chatting with Nick/ jungleboy earlier and he suggested that for the next league it may be a better idea to use total points scored minus total points scored against as the secondary ranking criteria (rather than average game score since this is based purely on total points scored and doesn't consider points allowed/ scored against at all). In sporting terms, Nick's suggestion would be the equivalent of goal difference rather than total goals scored. The latter being what I decided to go with since I didn't really think to consider any alternatives at the time.

But whilst it seemed fairly natural to organise the ranking the way I did (to me), I'm now aware that this might not match everyone else's way of thinking. This is particularly true for MrNumbers who has always played a very strong defensive game and correspondingly is well ahead of the competition in terms of total points difference (whereas I am just about ahead on average game score). Since a tie for first place in terms of league points seems like it could be a possibility, this is a particularly pertinent point at the moment and I didn't want there to be any hard feelings about it from anyone.

So to demonstrate my willingness to be transparent and keep things as fair as possible I just wanted to point out that if there is enough of a consensus between us to change things then I am prepared to do so, despite feeling that it would undermine the league as a whole if we were to change something so fundamental to how the rankings have previously been calculated at this stage.

So, if you have any strong feelings either way then do please let me know by posting here and I'll make sure they are addressed either in this league or the next!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 26, 2014, 10:17:54 PM
Since I am the person concerned, my opinion could not be counted. But still I agree that differential tie-breaker is "fairer" than just "goals scored". In Carcassonne World Cup, since we are planing group stage(s), I suggest to use mutual game result as a first tie-breaker and then "goal difference", but in League, where everyone plays with everyone, score difference is the best thing that can show true skill level of a particular player.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 27, 2014, 03:09:16 AM
Dan, the flaw (or weakness) in your proprosed tie-breaker also came to my mind but I had decided to hold my tongue. I'm glad you broached the subject first though.

In my opinion the first objective in the league is to win, the score is secondary. Even the score differential is secondary. I would have proposed the first tie-beraker be the head to head win/loss record between the tied players, then head to head point differential. If still tied then overall point differential.

I may have missed the post somewhere but I didn't see where the league format was laid out before we started.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 27, 2014, 03:45:32 AM
Here is a x-score of the CarcC League.

 
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 27, 2014, 03:48:14 AM
It should be 1 point in total for the match in case of a draw, not for every game in a match.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 27, 2014, 03:57:59 AM
I think we're all agreed that top priority will always be league points, it's how we resolve the resulting ties that complicates things.

As I see it, the trouble with looking to results from head-to-head matches as a secondary priority is that ties involving 3 or more players aren't easily settled. Who comes top if Player A beats Player B but loses to Player C and Player B beats Player C but loses to Player A? It's an awkward triangle that shouldn't occur but you can guarantee that it will if it makes life difficult!

I didn't really detail my thoughts on how ties would be settled because there wasn't a lot of thought to detail at the time. It seemed natural that average game score should be the secondary orderer though, and since nobody suggested otherwise at the time I assumed it was as fair as anything else and went with it.

Now though, I'm leaning a lot more towards changing this to "overall points differential" even though this will limit my chances of coming top since MrNumbers is a long way ahead of everyone else in this respect (speaking of whom, if my viewpoint is valid in this then MrNumbers' opinion should carry equal weight). Personally I'd rather lose something that was considered fair by everyone involved than win something that I'd inadvertently rigged in my own favour though, and this is what's most important to me.

I appreciate that it's a bit rubbish of me to want to change something so important at such a late stage though, and any objections will of course be carefully considered. Perhaps we'll just see what happens with the last two matches and then decide? If nothing else, at least we'll know that we've established a fair and reliable model that can be repeated for similar leagues in the future...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 27, 2014, 04:04:54 AM
Maybe in this case we should go American style and have playoffs? A one-game playoff (coin flip for who goes first) between danisthirty and MrNumbers for the championship if both are tied after the final round? That seems like the fairest way given the circumstances.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 27, 2014, 04:16:09 AM
In my opinion the first objective in the league is to win, the score is secondary. Even the score differential is secondary.

I agree on both counts. The second point is an interesting one, and another thing to think about. If you're in a strong position as the game enters the last stage and you're probably going to win, you can play conservately to ensure your victory rather than making risky moves that might increase your margin if they come off, but could lose you the game if they don't work.   
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 27, 2014, 08:08:23 AM
Maybe in this case we should go American style and have playoffs? A one-game playoff (coin flip for who goes first) between danisthirty and MrNumbers for the championship if both are tied after the final round? That seems like the fairest way given the circumstances.

I'm not sure my nerves could take another game against MrNumbers!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: quevy on June 27, 2014, 10:29:19 AM
I am in favor of any change of regulation that is deemed appropriate, the important thing is to play with other people.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 27, 2014, 10:58:18 AM
...Perhaps we'll just see what happens with the last two matches and then decide? ...

I don't think we should wait. Knowing the outcome will just compound the potential for bias, or the potential perception of bias. Better to decide it now, either way, before the results are known. Either stick with it the way it is or decide to change it.

I understand your concern, Dan, for getting into a round robin scenario of tied players. Even a round robin of three players can be worked out though. Since we'll have all played each other, either they will all be tied in record or one will be eliminated, or two will be eliminated. If there's a tie remaining then point differential against breaks it.

In our case, the only way there can be a tie between the three of us is if I beat MrNumbers outright (putting aside for the moment the fact that you would have to lose your next match). Between the three of us then I would have a win and a loss. You would have a win and draw. MrNumbers would have a draw and loss. You would own the tie-breaker in that scenario.

A tie between the two of you would go first to the draw between the two of you, which would maintain the tie, then to head to head point differential. In that case your margin of victory in your upcoming match, and my ability to score in my loss(es) to MrNumbers, both become very important to you.

Left the way it is now would give each of the three of us a shot at winning depending on how much we can improve our average score in two games. If there would be a tie there is a likelihood that the scores would draw closer than they are now, because the two of you would have to lose your matches and I would have to win, thereby muting your scores while bolstering mine. That could make it very close.

I am rambling...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 27, 2014, 01:03:36 PM
I am in favor of any change of regulation that is deemed appropriate, the important thing is to play with other people.

Totally agree!  :(y)

I think we've all agreed that average score per game isn't good enough and that total score differential makes sense, so I'm going to make this the secondary orderer. At this time it doesn't affect anyone other than MrNumbers and I, and he benefits from it as it puts him above me so hopefully this won't be a problem for anyone.

Whilst looking at individual results in the case of tie-breakers could be interesting, my feeling is that total score differential is a better representation of how someone has performed across the league as a whole. And I don't particularly like the idea that random unlucky games could come back to haunt people if they later end up in a tie with that same person.

I hope this all makes sense. I wanted to post this amendment now as I'm playing Rob in an hour and didn't want my decision to be influenced by this (not that it would) with just two matches left to play!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 27, 2014, 03:46:10 PM
I haven't really got time to do a proper write-up now as it's quite late here, but I just wanted to put a quick update on here to say that rfielder and I played our match this evening. The result was a 2 - 0 victory for me.

I felt like both games were really very close and wasn't at all confident that I was going to win either. I think Rob thought I was just saying this to be nice but he really was a strong player and this result could easily have been 2 - 0 in his favour but for the luck of the draw on this occasion...

Here are some screenshots:


(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round6_rfielder_Game1_Scores.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round6_rfielder_Game1_Map.jpg)


(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round6_rfielder_Game2_Scores.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/Round6_rfielder_Game2_Map.jpg)


I've done as much as I can now, it's over to Carcking and MrNumbers to do the rest!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 27, 2014, 11:52:48 PM
...and again some great games.

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 28, 2014, 04:13:28 AM
Congratulations, Dan!
Now I have only one chance and I will try to do my best :red-meeple:
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on June 28, 2014, 06:24:38 AM
I can only play spoiler now for MrNumbers.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on June 28, 2014, 07:32:41 AM
I am going for MrNumbers! If I have this correct, a victory for MrNumbers will see me finish outright third, or a draw will see Carcking and I tied for third.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 28, 2014, 02:17:51 PM
Yes that's correct jungleboy.

I think it's probably fairly obvious who I'm going to be supporting!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on June 29, 2014, 11:15:14 PM
MrNumbers and Carcking,
When does the final game take place?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 30, 2014, 12:09:22 AM
Tonight. It is sheduled at 19:00-20:00 my time. If nothing will go wrong, tonight we can announce the winner of the League.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on June 30, 2014, 02:28:52 AM
How exciting that it's all come down to the final match! I hope you both have great games regardless of who wins. Looking forward to seeing the result!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on June 30, 2014, 10:07:37 AM
Our match with Carcking is resheduled to tommorow's evening.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on June 30, 2014, 02:17:40 PM
Hi all. First I must say sorry to you all. I have had a bit of a crap time recently internet wise and free time wise. However I now have internet whilst I am staying at my parents so if the league will still have me then I am eager to catch up. I am available after 7 gmt moat evenings and then at some point during weekend's.

If the league is now too far on or in fact over, then I will wait for the next one.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 01, 2014, 12:32:46 AM
Hi Rosco. It's good to hear from you again.

My intention for this league was always that everyone should play everyone else and this remains even though you've missed the last 3 rounds.if you're able to catch up I see no reason why you shouldn't be allowed to continue.

With this in mind, you still need to play Carcking, jungleboy, jvnoledawg and myself. I think availability for Carcking and jungleboy this week should be quite good although you also need to liaise with rfielder or MrNumbers when youarrange your matches. I genuinely don't know when you will get to play jvnoledawg but I am still in touch with him by email and I think he is hopeful that he will be able to play his matches at some point.

I am currently on holiday but will be back in about a week so we can play sometime next week...

Please arrange your matches by email and post back here when you've played. Looking forward to seeing the results!

Obviously this will leave things within the league a little unbalanced but hopefully this can be worked out when jvnoledawg is able to continue...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 01, 2014, 01:19:57 AM
In given scenario there are two possible variants:
1. If after Rosco will play his matches jvnoledawg is available we finish our League as planned.
2. If jvnoledawg is not available by that time, to return balance I suggest to players who had the chance to play with him not to count points received from those games in the overall standings.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on July 01, 2014, 05:49:43 AM
In given scenario there are two possible variants:
1. If after Rosco will play his matches jvnoledawg is available we finish our League as planned.
2. If jvnoledawg is not available by that time, to return balance I suggest to players who had the chance to play with him not to count points received from those games in the overall standings.

This sounds fair to me.

As for availability, I can play tonight (Tuesday) after 8pm my time (Central European Time), tomorrow night or Thursday night. I'm not sure yet about this weekend. Next week I should be free at night from Monday-Thursday, but after next Thursday I won't be able to play for 3.5 weeks as I'll be abroad with only Apple products to keep me company.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 01, 2014, 11:51:50 AM
We have finished our match with Carcking.
2:0 in my favour.
106:50 and 132:96.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on July 01, 2014, 12:57:53 PM
Congratulations to you MrNumbers...

Here comes the new list CarcC League - X-Score1
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on July 01, 2014, 01:18:01 PM
Done - one game each
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on July 01, 2014, 01:19:24 PM
Rosco and I just played our match and it was 1-1, with the winner being the player who went 2nd both times. The first game was 130-97 to me, the second was 114-86 to Rosco.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on July 01, 2014, 01:29:41 PM
Th first game was a bit of a runaway for Jungleboy but with some risky tactics and perserverence, game 2 was mine!

Thanks for a great match!

I only have saved the picture from game 2 - Jungleboy, do you have the other one?

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on July 01, 2014, 01:32:08 PM
Carcking - you are next!  when are you available?

Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: kettlefish on July 01, 2014, 01:38:27 PM
What happens with not yet played games of jvnoledawg?

Do we put an other member in this League? Perhaps Jere if he like...




Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 01, 2014, 01:49:04 PM
I only have saved the picture from game 2 - Jungleboy, do you have the other one?

I have saved both pictures. Here is game 1.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 01, 2014, 01:50:20 PM
...and better quality of game 2.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on July 01, 2014, 01:51:02 PM
Thanks to MrNumbers for hosting on short notice, and congrats on your victory against Carcking.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 01, 2014, 01:53:36 PM
What happens with not yet played games of jvnoledawg?

Dan is in contact with him. There is a chance that in the nearest future jvnoledawg will be able to finish his remaining matches.

And thanks for updating overall standings.

Thanks to MrNumbers for hosting on short notice, and congrats on your victory against Carcking.

No problem! :)
Thanks for the congratulations! Now the spoiler for me can be Rosco's game against Dan ;)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 01, 2014, 02:25:51 PM
Man I picked a rubbish week to be on holiday. I'm out in the country where there isn't very good internet. So much has been happening though and I really feel like I'm missing out!

Well done MrNumbers on your victory against Carcking. And well done to Rosco and jungleboy for playing their match at such short notice.

Discounting games against jvnoledawg leaves MrNumbers score unchanged but reduced mine by 1 with one matchto play against Rosco. Hopefully we can hold this match next week. Hopefully Rosco and Carcking will have played their match by then too.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on July 01, 2014, 09:36:50 PM
We have finished our match with Carcking.
2:0 in my favour.
106:50 and 132:96.

Congrats to MrNumbers! He mopped the floor with me. I must say I have never felt like I had such unlucky games as those two. I could not draw a single key tile and MrNumbers drew everyone he needed - but I have the sense that this has a lot more to do with MrNumbers' game play than pure bad luck. Good think I still have my day job :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 02, 2014, 12:12:33 AM
We have finished our match with Carcking.
2:0 in my favour.
106:50 and 132:96.

Congrats to MrNumbers! He mopped the floor with me. I must say I have never felt like I had such unlucky games as those two. I could not draw a single key tile and MrNumbers drew everyone he needed - but I have the sense that this has a lot more to do with MrNumbers' game play than pure bad luck. Good think I still have my day job :)

There wasn't so bad, Carcking! I admit that I have some lucky draws, but you did what you could with tiles you drew. You have quite interesting strategy: at times when I would try to connect to opponent's feature, you wait for a moment, maybe to estimate value of that feature, maybe to lull the vigilance :)
Later I will try to write up more detailed report.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on July 02, 2014, 07:48:43 AM
...You have quite interesting strategy: at times when I would try to connect to opponent's feature, you what for a moment, maybe to estimate value of that feature, maybe to lull the vigilance :)

Well, yes, but everytime I let you get a couple of followers into a feature, then tried to block and trap, you drew the exact tile you needed on the next draw. On every key feature you drew the exact tile you needed while I could not. That was amazingly curious for me. I couldn't help but think I was missing something in my game, but there was nothing I could do for it. You are a very good player and deserve the wins! Good going!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 02, 2014, 10:22:54 AM
The games where the tiles seem stacked against you are always the worst. I've been mostly quite lucky so far although MrNumbers tore me apart in our second game as I grew increasingly desperate to tie the farm (which wouldn't have been enough to have won the game anyway but might have spared me some humiliation). I have a video of it which I will have to publish as a how-to guide to not winning at Carcassonne. Anyway, I feel your pain!

Carcking - do you think you will be playing Rosco tonight/ this week?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on July 02, 2014, 03:02:12 PM

What happens with not yet played games of jvnoledawg?

Do we put an other member in this League? Perhaps Jere if he like...

Yep, I'd like to join whenever it will be possible
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Carcking on July 02, 2014, 05:30:47 PM
Carcking - do you think you will be playing Rosco tonight/ this week?

Not this week. Maybe this weekend. What is the time difference between us?
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on July 02, 2014, 09:46:43 PM
I am in the uk
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 08, 2014, 03:40:08 AM
Hello all, I'm back from holiday now and am already wondering how I coped for an entire week away from the joys of a reliable internet connection!

It seems like a lot has happened since my last update; for one thing we've finished round 6! Here's how things looked at the end of it:

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r6_breakdown.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r6_overall_standings.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r6_rank_by_attack.jpg)
(http://www.dan.tehill.net/r6_rank_by_defence.jpg)

Despite my last-minute changing of the rules such that the secondary ranking criteria became total score differential (total points won minus total points allowed) rather than average game score MrNumbers would have finished on top regardless, as he has done.

We were also rejoined by Rosco who came back with a new-found desire to play out the rest of his league matches against Carcking, jungleboy and myself. In order to accommodate this, the decision was made to exclude games played against jvnoledawg from the overall standings unless he is also ready to play his remaining matches in the near future. So although they have now been removed, obviously I will keep a record of jvnoledawg's matches such that the results can be added back in again if/ when they are required. If I get time I'll post a screenshot of the overall league standings updated to reflect these changes.

Of the three outstanding "Rosco matches", jungleboy vs Rosco is the only one to have taken part so far. This ended in a draw which meant jungleboy's overall league score was unchanged since his match with jvnoledawg also ended in a draw. Another consequence of this is that my league score is reduced from 14 to 13 (since I also drew against jvnoledawg) but it does give me a chance to increase it to 16 if I can achieve a win against Rosco, or back to 14 for a draw. Unfortunately for Carcking he now needs to beat Rosco to hold on to fourth position as the exclusion of his win against jvnoledawg means he could slip behind quevy who would then move up to fourth in the case of a win or a draw for Rosco against Carcking.

I'm hoping that I'll be able to play Rosco tonight at 9pm GMT (UK) but haven't heard from him for almost a week and am a little concerned that he may have fallen off the edge of the internet again. All being well though, I should be able to post some more results this evening.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Rosco on July 08, 2014, 02:49:03 PM
What a match!!!!! Thanks again Dan. I will let you tell the story since you won!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 09, 2014, 03:59:23 AM
Many thanks to you too Rosco, that was an excellent match! I would have written something about it last night, but whilst my memory was fresh my brain was fried so I thought I'd leave it until today:

http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=869
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 09, 2014, 05:04:24 AM
Congratulations, Dan!
Now only miracle (e.g. jvnoledawg return) can save me from the 2nd place :D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 09, 2014, 05:38:31 AM
Thanks MrNumbers! :)

I am still hopeful that he may return and have emailed him recently but no response yet. I have also suggested that if he doesn't join in then there will still be a place for him in future leagues if he wishes to take part the next time one is run...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 17, 2014, 03:31:25 AM
Exciting news - Carcking and Rosco have had their match! I was hosting so got to watch the action live and can safely say that they were two of the closest games I've ever watched. In both games I thought Carcking seemed to have the edge and was heading for a narrow victory, but in both cases I was wrong and Rosco emerged victorious (finishing the second game with a bit of a flourish!)

Since I've not had a response to either of my last two emails to Joe/ jvnoledawg I can only assume that he has withdrawn from the league. Whilst this is a shame and a disappointment, it does mean that there are now no matches left to play. So that's it, we're finished; after 10 weeks, 42 games and 8413 points we're finally here!

To conclude, here's a round-up of the final three rounds (Rosco's last three matches) followed by the usual summaries of total points won, total points allowed and overall league standings:


(http://www.dan.tehill.net/rounds_7_to_9.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/final_scores_breakdown.jpg)

(http://www.dan.tehill.net/final_standings.jpg)


Naturally I'm quite happy with this result, but this is purely because the competition was so strong that it really felt like a huge achievement (albeit one that was assisted by a lot of luck)! I can honestly say that I didn't play a single easy game, many of them were won or lost with the last tile and at least half of them could very easily have gone either way (Carcking in particular will know what I'm talking about here and how big a difference a single tile placement cane make)...

Thanks to everyone for taking part, I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did and I look forward to repeating it all again in a few months time. I've learnt a lot from this experience both in terms of playing Carcassonne competitively and also in organising such tournaments, so there will be a couple of changes to the way things are run next time and hopefully these will help to make things run much more smoothly and fairly for everyone involved.

Thanks also to kettlefish for her support for the league in general and for helping to arrange some of the cooler bits and pieces that everyone will be receiving in their goody bags soon (hopefully).

Until the next time!
Dan :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on July 17, 2014, 06:00:32 AM
Congratulations to Dan! :(y)
It's a pity that Joe could not complete his matches (in that case the winner could have changed >:D)

One question to Dan: I thought that we agreed at the model "2-1 points" in case of a draw in one of the match'es games? In that case you would have 15 points (no changes in final standings) and Rosco - 6 points (+1 in final standings).
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on July 17, 2014, 06:19:11 AM
Thanks MrNumbers!

I was hoping that Joe would come back for that very reason as I’m aware that excluding my draw against him gave me an advantage in reaching the top spot (it wasn't so good for Carcking who had a win against him which was replaced with a loss against Rosco - but I was on holiday when this decision was made and couldn't have come up with a better/ fairer alternative anyway). We can’t wait forever in any case so I think it’s better that we just call it a day and move on to the next competition (Carcassonne World Cup)!  8)

Yes we did agree to change the points awarded if one game of a match ends in a draw, but I didn’t want to make any further changes to the rules we established for this league (albeit that there were some small flaws) and so was going to class it as an “unbalanced draw” and write it up properly before embarking on the next league competition:

Match Win = 3 league points
Game scores: 2 – 0 (one player wins both games)

Match Draw = 1 league point each
Game scores: 1 – 1 (both players win one game and lose one game, or both games are tied)

Unbalanced Draw = 2 or 1 league point(s) depending on outcome of won/lost game
Game scores: 2 – 1 (if one game ends in a draw, the player who won the other game is awarded 2 points whereas the player with the draw and the loss receives 1 point)

Further rules/ clarifications will be included regarding missed matches, drop-outs and no-shows to keep things moving in the right direction.

I’m hoping to reignite things with the Carcassonne World Cup next week now that the Football World Cup has finished.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on August 14, 2014, 03:02:35 AM
Hello all!

I just wanted to post a quick message here to apologise for the delay in getting the goody bags sent out. I won’t go into the full details as to why this is, but please know that it isn’t entirely down to laziness on my part!  O:-)

All being well, it seems likely that I will be able to send them out at some point next week. So, expect something through your door in about two weeks time!

Dan
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on August 14, 2014, 03:41:29 AM
Good to know! :(y)
Waiting with patience :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on August 19, 2014, 05:19:49 AM
Goody Bags are now in the post! Please let me know when you receive yours so I know that nothing has gone missing. :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on August 19, 2014, 06:38:20 AM
Thanks Dan! I'll just go ahead and assume that you included The Cathars in my goody bag so that you won't have to send me another package after the WC :)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on August 19, 2014, 06:45:58 AM
I'll just go ahead and assume that you included The Cathars in my goody bag so that you won't have to send me another package after the WC :)

What a confidence! See you in semi-finals! ;) >:D
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on August 19, 2014, 06:54:28 AM
Postage isn't cheap you know! Don't underestimate the financial motivation behind the person who may have to send it if he doesn't win...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on August 19, 2014, 08:53:18 AM
Actually with Jere and MrNumbers in my half of the draw I am not very confident at all, so I thought I should start talking a bit of trash now before I get eliminated!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on March 03, 2015, 09:08:41 AM
I calculated the final ELO rating for this league:

1299 Danisthirty
1294 MrNumbers
1226 Jungleboy
1187 Rosco
1173 jvnoledawg
1172 Quevy
1167 Carking
1082 rfielder

I wanted to do this for the current league (T&B 2015) but since everything has to be in chronological order I needed to start from the beginning.

Also, every games count so that's why you see a ghost reappearing (jvnoledawg).

What is ELO rating?? Have a look here:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: rfielder on March 03, 2015, 09:15:20 AM
I calculated the final ELO rating for this league:
I am not clear - does this include the T&B games?  If so, would the numbers be skewed since I did not participate?

Also, monwil did participate in the previous competition, but I don't see anything for her.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on March 03, 2015, 09:16:41 AM
I think this is literally just for the original league that the 7/ 8 of us took part in last May/ June/ July...
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on March 03, 2015, 09:26:21 AM
Yes, it's just the very first league. It does not include the World Cup nor the current T&B league yet. Give me some time, it's actually quite a bit of work especially for this league as the chronological order wasn't so clear with Rosco playing all his remaining games at the end.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on March 03, 2015, 09:32:01 AM
Yes, it's just the very first league. It does not include the World Cup nor the current T&B league yet. Give me some time, it's actually quite a bit of work especially for this league as the chronological order wasn't so clear with Rosco playing all his remaining games at the end.

Good luck Jere! I had a read through the link you posted and despite thinking I had a reasonable background in maths I was scared off almost immediately! Tracking ELO seems like a worthwhile thing to do though if you're happy to do so?

I've never really recorded the results chronologically as I'd never really seen the point. You can probably get some idea of the order of the games by reading through the threads where the results were posted but you might find that some weren't posted there for whatever reason.

Merit for your efforts!  :(y)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on March 03, 2015, 09:57:02 AM
Yes that's what I did, I've read the whole thread (13 pages) to figure out the order.

Well, I'm not crazy enough to do all the calculations by hand. I found a spreadsheet online I could use with all formulas already included. :)

Just some technical details: starting rating of 1200 was used for everyone and the K factor is 30.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: jungleboy on March 03, 2015, 01:01:14 PM
Great job Jéré, merit for you!
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on March 04, 2015, 04:48:54 AM
Just some technical details: starting rating of 1200 was used for everyone and the K factor is 30.

Starting rating I can understand but what is the K Factor?
Title: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: Jéré on March 04, 2015, 04:55:05 AM
Maximum points you can win or loose for a single match.

edit: I completed the calculations for the world cup and will publish later today.
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: MrNumbers on March 04, 2015, 04:55:23 AM
Just some technical details: starting rating of 1200 was used for everyone and the K factor is 30.

Starting rating I can understand but what is the K Factor?

Same article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system#The_K-factor_used_by_the_USCF (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system#The_K-factor_used_by_the_USCF)
Title: Re: A Carcassonne League?
Post by: danisthirty on March 04, 2015, 04:58:33 AM
Just some technical details: starting rating of 1200 was used for everyone and the K factor is 30.

Starting rating I can understand but what is the K Factor?

Same article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system#The_K-factor_used_by_the_USCF (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system#The_K-factor_used_by_the_USCF)

I read that K = 800 / (Ne + m) and was still none clearer as to what it meant  ???

Maximum points you can win or loose for a single match.

edit: I completed the calculations for the world cup and will publish later today.

Wow, you have been busy! The World Cup didn't go very well for me so I'm interested to see how the ratings came out...