KICKSTARTER (watch your purses)

[danisthirty]

Somebody on the BGG Facebook group posted a link to a game called Highway System today.

It's a tile laying game with hexagons, and the idea is to build the longest highway. Seems quite Carc-like in some ways, and potentially a bit hit and miss in others.

Although you can download a print and play version for free if you sign up to their newsletter, there's going to be a KickStarter for this in December which I might back depending on how much money they want for it. Definitely looks interesting although not sure about the replay value...

[jungleboy]

Today I got an email from Queen Games about a delay of several months for their Kickstarter delivery for the Escape big box and some other games. Unfortunately this is easily the worst KS pledge I have made, because it turns out that I could have got basically the same thing for much cheaper (and now much earlier) at Essen.

[kettlefish]

Today I got an email from Queen Games about a delay of several months for their Kickstarter delivery for the Escape big box and some other games. Unfortunately this is easily the worst KS pledge I have made, because it turns out that I could have got basically the same thing for much cheaper (and now much earlier) at Essen.

Queen Games is a regular games publisher - that means the games will come regular in the shelfs of the shops. There are many postings at BGG how this publisher work with their authors and other people. I am not a friend of Kickstarter in gerneral, but Queen Games and what they are doing with Kickstarter is an absolute no go.

jungleboy I am so sorry for you. How many money do you spend to this game publisher through Kickstarter?

[jungleboy]

Queen Games is a regular games publisher - that means the games will come regular in the shelfs of the shops. There are many postings at BGG how this publisher work with their authors and other people. I am not a friend of Kickstarter in gerneral, but Queen Games and what they are doing with Kickstarter is an absolute no go.

Yes, a good lesson learned here.

jungleboy I am so sorry for you. How many money do you spend to this game publisher through Kickstarter?

Well it's a big box for Escape: Curse of the Temple, so there are many expansions. The price was $80.

Edit: USD, not €.

[Chooselife]

I'm not experienced with Queen Games but it all depends on the feeling you have when you pledge.

My most delayed backed project is by far The 7 Continent, funding ended on October 2015 and was expected to be fulfilled by October 2016, but the success was such that the added amount of stretch goals and new content as pushed the fulfillment to May 2017.

And I'm not even mad since the support, information and overall "customer service" provided by the creators has been great from the start.
I recently commented the below on the its comment section when replying to delay critics:
".... Kickstart is a bet, you put you're money in ,on more or less limited information, and just hope you're on the winning side of it. For me being on the loosing side is not when the project isn't delivered and fail at all, that's just how betting works, the loosing side is when you don't bet and loose the opportunity to get what increasingly from the start appears to be an epic game. I see production delays as something that increase the odds of: first getting the game; second getting the very best game the creator can output. @Creators: I really $#&#%&#&$ want to play this one but please take your time to make sure I will put your very best work on my table, because what we have seen till now is #$"#%&$ AWESOME."

Now I don't really know how Queen Games is working but I'd guess that being "a regular game publisher" they are using Kickstarter to turn around their cashflow by having the money in before ordering the games instead of allocating resources/loans first on production and wait for the retail profits.
While I can understand what they are doing from the corporation side I agree that this is not what Kickstarter was created for, mainly giving chance to smaller creators/artists/inventors, and not only doesn't it excuse any delays of fulfillment but it indeed give additional responsibility to an established publisher to present flawless campaigns.

[Decar]

I'm looking forward to 7th Continent too.  What I really appreciate is their weekly/fortnightly updates to let us know what they're working on.  I really don't care how long a game takes to get completed, so long as progress is being made.

I like how Queen Games was able to say that nothing could be done to prevent the delays of 7 projects.... maybe not running 7 projects at the same time, or maybe not letting their staff go on 3 week holidays without telling anyone would mean they could deliver faster.  It's a shame Queen Games has so many great titles - there are plenty of other publishers that could produce the IPs.

[danisthirty]

Today I got an email from Queen Games about a delay of several months for their Kickstarter delivery for the Escape big box and some other games. Unfortunately this is easily the worst KS pledge I have made, because it turns out that I could have got basically the same thing for much cheaper (and now much earlier) at Essen.

I chose to back the Escape: Zombie City game (how could I not?) which was kind of packaged into the same KickStarter as the Escape big box. I received the same email as you to say that I now won’t be receiving it until March/ April next year.

I know that QG aren’t the only people to do this, but I was thoroughly unimpressed to see Escape: Zombie City available to buy in Essen while I was still waiting to receive my “pre-order”. The fact that I’m now going to be waiting until March/ April (approximately half a year after I could have bought it in Essen if I’d had nothing to do with their KickStarter) is even less impressive and doesn’t inspire me to back anything of theirs on KickStarter again. I’ve heard it said that QG don’t exactly embody the spirit of KickStarter with their projects but how do they think their backers are supposed to react to their “buy now, get in 9 months” vs. “buy in 2 months, get in 2 months” attitude? Surely they can’t simply keep doing this over and over again? Why do they even put anything on KickStarter since it’s abundantly clear that they don’t need the money up-front to make their games happen?

Another thing that bothered me was that their email made absolutely no attempt to apologise for the situation in any way. It was literally just telling me that my game was going to be arriving much later than originally stated and that I should deal with it. I find it hard to believe that they’re so unrepentant about the fact that they’ve let so many people down that they couldn’t even squeeze a small “sorry” somewhere into their message even if they didn’t mean it. Compare that to the likes of Biergarten (and undoubtedly many others) which was also delayed, but I wasn’t fussed as the guy behind it seemed genuinely distraught in his message and couldn’t apologise enough. I get that both games are being manufactured on an entirely different scale but in both cases the delays were caused by “circumstance beyond their control” and the feeling I get from QG is that they couldn’t care less; they’ve got their money now and they’ll probably deliver the game at some point so what’s all the fuss about?

Ultimately, QG are a big business and they are behaving like one in terms of putting revenue first at the expense of their customers’ satisfaction/ experience of them. They don’t need to offer much in the way of good customer service as they have many good titles that are well made to a high standard and which can be sold globally with or without the support of KickStarter or several hundred/ thousand naysayers like me who’ve had their fingers burnt. With this in mind though, it’s annoying that they can claim that they’re not ignoring emails and will get round to replying but that we should bear with them because they’ve had a lot of emails. A lot of businesses receive a lot of emails and a lot of businesses employ sufficient people to respond to them within an acceptable timeframe. Pretending that poor Doris from the contact centre is having to work her fingers to the bone to respond to everyone individually and that production has been delayed because of poor Ted in the workshop having to go in to have his hernia seen to in time for Christmas is just as insulting as the time they blamed a lack of email correspondence/ delivery on the fact that one of their staff had gone on holiday. Holiday cover? Proper management? More staff? If they’d just face up to the fact that they are the ones to blame for their failures then they might at least be able to start towards making a move in the right direction.

But regardless of all this, I’ll probably buy from them again. I won’t back anything of theirs on KickStarter but I like to play games and if I play a good game that I want to play again I’ll usually buy it without a thought for who profits from my purchase. In fact, I remember seeing Escape: Zombie City in Essen and telling Tom that I’d never buy another game from QG. Then we played Glux (after about half an hour of waiting for a table) a few days later and I bought it straight away.

[Decar]

I remember seeing Escape: Zombie City in Essen and telling Tom that I’d never buy another game from QG. Then we played Glux (after about half an hour of waiting for a table) a few days later and I bought it straight away.

It's a drug Dan...just say no :p

[dirk2112]

So Queen Games uses Kickstarter as an advertisement platform and a way to get cash in hand quickly.  Good to know.  I will avoid them.

Unrelated to Queen games, my Pack O Game 2 order has been delayed.  I ordered this specifically as a stocking stuffer for my wife and son.  Now that it is coming in January, it no longer serves it's purpose.  Lesson learned, don't Kickstart anything for gift giving purposes.

[jungleboy]

Unrelated to Queen games, my Pack O Game 2 order has been delayed.  I ordered this specifically as a stocking stuffer for my wife and son.  Now that it is coming in January, it no longer serves its purpose.  Lesson learned, don't Kickstart anything for gift giving purposes.

Sorry to hear that Dirk. I also backed Pack O Games 2. In my case, it was to use them as travel games, so personally the delay in this case doesn't cause me any problems, since I won't really be needing them until mid-2017.

[Decar]

I won't really be needing them until mid-2017.

You've cursed it now Jungleboy!   

[dirk2112]

If they get delayed more, they can be Xmas 2017 gifts 

[franks]

I was also bit by this the Queen Games delay on both Marshlands and Harvest. I just received Harvest last week after the long delay and at least that will tide me over until Harvest.

But yes, these were my first and last Queen Kickstarter's. On the good side I do have confidence that they will at least 'eventually' deliver.

[CKorfmann]

Here is the list of things I backed.  I've purposely avoided lots of things. 

Flash Point: Fire Rescue and it's first expansion.  I later sold them in an auction, but have since replaced them and the rest of the set from a great sale on Amazon. 
Coin Age
This Town Ain't Big Enough for the 2-4 of Us!
Sphere's of Magic (Pathfinder supplement)

I've also backed a couple sets of designer playing cards, The Dice Tower, and Man Vs. Meeple (mostly for the promos).

My big regret is not backing the game Roll Player.  I saw the Kickstarter and really wanted to do it, but couldn't pull the trigger.  Now I really want it and am sitting on a paid pre-order that likely won't be filled until March 2017.

I don't know what you might have heard about Game Salute, but they are, apparently, notorious for terrible KS campaigns.  I didn't back the Alien Frontiers Big Box, but I did write them to order the upgrade pack (since I already have the game) after the fact.  This KS has been horrible with little to no communication the whole time.  It was supposed to ship in March of 2016 and they are supposedly going to be shipping this week, finally (just in time for Christmas).  Keep in mind that this is not a game they had to produce from scratch, this is for a game they already had everything completed for, they only had to create a master rulebook and a new box and insert.  From what I understand, their problems are not limited to this campaign and they just keep starting new ones before the previous ones, and all their many issues, are solved.  They've lost a tremendous amount of support from the comments I've seen.  I feel sorry for the game designer.   

I've heard equally bad things about Queen Games and the polar opposite about Stonemaier  Games.  I understand their campaigns are flawless.

[jungleboy]

I don't know what you might have heard about Game Salute, but they apparently are notorious for terrible KS campaigns. 

Good to know, thanks. I'm interested in one of their games (King's Forge) that has been on KS three different times (including expansion campaigns). I'm still trying to figure out the best way to acquire this game because it's not super easy to find in Europe but I thought one possibility might have been to back a future KS campaign and see if you could add-on the base game and previous expansions.