Carcassonne Central

Carc Central Community => Online Games and Competitions => Topic started by: Jéré on January 30, 2017, 09:01:12 AM

Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on January 30, 2017, 09:01:12 AM
I've often been asked what is this strange Elo thing. I think it's important to write a few lines about this since it is used for all online competitions held on Carcassonne Central. This thread is an attempt to make it clearer.

What is the Elo rating?

It's a method used to calculate your relative skill level in 1vs1 matches. It was originally used for Chess but it is also applicable to other games, like Carcassonne!

How does it work?

Before you play your very first game, your score is set to 1200 and this score goes up and down as you win or lose matches. How many points you win or lose depends on the score of your opponent. Basically, the strongest your opponent (compared to you), the more points you get if you win. You can get a big reward for winning against all odds a match versus an opponent that is considered much stronger than you, but beware, losing against a player that has a much lower score can have the opposite effect! Interestingly, you won't lose too many points if you lose against a strong opponent... because Elo predicted you'd lose! That's right, Elo ratings are used to predict the outcome of a specific match. By comparing the Elo ratings of 2 players, you can tell who's going to win... but that's theory of course!

Unfortunately, it would be too much work to publish the Elo variations after every single game played at Carcassonne Central. Therefore, it was decided to publish the Elo ratings only after competition milestones. But if you are curious about your current score before its publication, don't hesitate to ask. Send me a PM! Also my spreadsheet is available upon request.

What about ties?

If you tie a game with stronger player, you will get points and he/she will lose a few! Simply because it goes against the predicted outcome: Stronger player should win.

Self-correcting system? What is this?

Imagine a big elastic rubber band, that's the Elo system. Say you're on a losing streak and your score gets too low, eventually you'll bounce back (be patient it can take time), prove Elo wrong and gain rating points until your rating better reflects your playing skill value. In the same vein, being the top-ranked player is not the most comfortable position, as all other players have lower scores and any loss could hurt your rating badly. In other words, top-ranked player must keep winning which becomes increasingly difficult! The same elastic rubber band that helps you to bounce back can also bring you down!

Want to know more?

There is a wikipedia page here (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system) with way too much detail. :)

See below the Elo ratings that were published after each major competition. New rankings will be published also in this thread for easy reference. Comments/Suggestions are very welcome!

Basegame League 2014 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=712.msg20381#msg20381)
World Cup 2014 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=991.msg20435#msg20435) 
T&B League 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1556.msg20995#msg20995) 
I&C League 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1589.msg22909#msg22909)
A&M League 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1895.msg25831#msg25831) 
World Cup 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2123.msg31952#msg31952) 
P&D League 2016 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2341.msg40138#msg40138) 
Tower League 2016 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2823.msg44127#msg44127) 
World Cup 2016 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=2968.msg45783#msg45783)

Current ranking (as of May 11th, 2018):
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180511/9b3d62930ebcc9c654d11ddd89068498.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on January 30, 2017, 09:34:12 AM
Say you're on a losing streak and your score gets too low, eventually you'll bounce back (be patient it can take time)...

I'm trying! :o

Many thanks for this great post Jéré, it was a very interesting read! Funny how I almost got to the top of the Elo ladder after doing well in the 2015 World Cup and then the Princess & Dragon league, but seem to be in free fall at the moment!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on January 30, 2017, 10:47:40 AM
This one is missing from the list:
A&M League 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1895.msg25831#msg25831)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on January 30, 2017, 12:35:32 PM
This one is missing from the list:
A&M League 2015 (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1895.msg25831#msg25831)

Ups! Fixed! Thanks!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on February 01, 2017, 11:26:13 PM
Update: Feb 2nd 2017

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/ab62e705cedaa37c35b3b278b50b3930.jpg)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on February 13, 2017, 12:38:39 PM
Update: Feb 13th 2017

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170213/7d67fc2eb45014aa286ec42a494d5ecc.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on February 13, 2017, 03:46:57 PM
Thanks for your tireless efforts keeping these up to date Jéré. :(y)

I have a question though: a friend of mine, lets call him IanisFifty, is obsessed with this game called Barkassonne (it's a bit like Carcassonne but with dogs) and is an admin at www.barkassonnecentral.com where he takes place in the occasional tournament against other members of the community there. Anyway, although he likes to pretend that he's actually pretty good, his Elo rating has been falling steadily over recent competitions and he just wondered what would happen if/ when it reaches 0? Is it possible for it to go below 0? He really wants to know... :'(
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on February 28, 2017, 09:01:46 AM
Thanks for your tireless efforts keeping these up to date Jéré. :(y)

I have a question though: a friend of mine, lets call him IanisFifty, is obsessed with this game called Barkassonne (it's a bit like Carcassonne but with dogs) and is an admin at www.barkassonnecentral.com where he takes place in the occasional tournament against other members of the community there. Anyway, although he likes to pretend that he's actually pretty good, his Elo rating has been falling steadily over recent competitions and he just wondered what would happen if/ when it reaches 0? Is it possible for it to go below 0? He really wants to know... :'(

Say that we start again with an Elo rating of 1200 and we play each other like there is no tomorrow and in the process I give you the greatest Carcassonne lesson in the history.... well, after losing 157 games in a row, you'd reach an Elo of 845, and beyond that you wouldn't lose any more points playing against me because the gap would be too great (eg. 1555 vs 845). I wouldn't gain, you wouldn't lose anymore. You'd have to keep losing against other extremely low rated players. The bottom line is that even if you really try to lose, it is quite unlikely to happen, and would take forever...
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on February 28, 2017, 09:41:29 AM
Thanks Jéré, I'll let IanisFifty know... :) :(y)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on March 01, 2017, 01:44:12 PM
Update: March 1st 2017

(Removed by Jéré, see March 4th update)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on March 01, 2017, 02:55:38 PM
Jéré, shouldn't this update include results of the BCB expansion league? It apparently doesn't.
E.g. you lost a game before our basegame league match in the BCB league so your initial rating should be lower than it was after the 2nd round of the basegame league. If I'm not mistaken than the order of the games is significant in terms of calculating Elo.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on March 02, 2017, 01:27:38 AM
Jéré, shouldn't this update include results of the BCB expansion league? It apparently doesn't.
E.g. you lost a game before our basegame league match in the BCB league so your initial rating should be lower than it was after the 2nd round of the basegame league. If I'm not mistaken than the order of the games is significant in terms of calculating Elo.

Excellent question Leven! And not so easy to answer...

There are good reasons why I did that, and there are also good reasons why I shouldn't have done that...

It is actually quite a luxury to have an Elo update every 2 weeks. The format of the basegame league is easy to follow and record so I opted for what was more convenient for me. It gets more complex if I need to monitor 4 threads and look at the all the timestamps of the posts to figure out the chronological order. I'm afraid to lose my sanity while doing that... it seems that I would need to read all competition threads on a daily basis not to lose track. My idea was to append the BC&B league results to the Basegame league results after the group stages are completed. I actually did not even start to record the BC&B league results! When I do, I usually start scanning a thread from page 1 until the end and write down all the scores.

Believe me, as a perfectionist, I am really annoyed by this... at the moment, I chose convenience over accuracy but I am seriously considering fixing this. I would need to update my Excel spreadsheet to add a column to track the date and time of each game and start entering the results after each game, and not by block of competition like it is now.

A disadvantage of doing that is also that the Elo updates will be less meaningful. I mean that, right now, it is pretty clear how well you are doing compared to others because everybody has played an equal number of games after a complete round. If I would include partial results of the BC&B league, these clear results are diluted and mixed other incomplete results... which gives something not really pleasant to look at or try to understand. I guess it would be up to the indivudual players to keep in mind how many games they have played since the last update... or I could perhaps list all the games that are included in each update, but again, this could be a LOT of work. I have fun doing this but if one day it becomes too tedious I might lose interest, hence the reason to keep the balance.

I am really struggling with the idea of mixing the results of two different competitions. Did you also noticed that I use a different cell colour to indicate who's in and who's out (non-participants are greyed out)? That info would be lost also. I'll have to put more thoughts into this. The fact that the Basegame league spans over a long period of time pretty much answers the question: I can no longer delay the publication of the results of the BC&B league! I might cancel the last uptade and start over to insert the BC&B league results in such way that the chronological order is honoured.

My sincere apologies for the confusion!

Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: thodekey on March 02, 2017, 02:17:01 AM
Just a thought, Jéré:

As a -yet not that good- table tennis player in an official competition, i have a ELO-ranking for that sport.  All the participating players can watch their ELO-points, results and statistics online all of the time.  All every club in that league has to do, is charging their own results in the system and ELO-points are automatically recalculated.  Even when there is a tournament and those results are charged later than other later results, the date of the game is taken in notice so the ELO-ranking is all of the time updated and recalculated.  To exclude 'fraude' with the results, the opponent of the player/club who gave in the results in the system, has to confirm those results.
An exemple of my not so marvellous season, for the moment:

http://competitie.vttl.be/?menu=6&sel=31902&result=1&category=1

Pretty sure you'll understand the language in the link, given the fact we speak the same language - yet, in a totally different way. :-)

For the record: i'm not suggesting to make the same kind of platform yourself - that would be way too time-consuming and keep you away of the real deal: playing Carcassonne - but I wonder if there isn't a platform online somewhere that we could use.  In that way, results and ELO-rankings would always be up to date.
And if there is a way the participants to the league games can give in themselves the results of the games online, that would decrease your work a lot - which is much appreciated by the way.

Maybe this is a helpful link?
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-free-Elo-rating-system-software

Groeten,
Thodekey
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on March 04, 2017, 05:41:45 AM
Update: March 4th 2017

This update takes into account all games played in the Round 3 of the Basegame league, 14 games played in the BC&B league and well as the first 2 games played in the Round 4 of the Basegame league.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170304/5328ce7e6fb5f6f68ff043d3a8422809.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on March 04, 2017, 05:50:00 AM
Just a thought, Jéré:

As a -yet not that good- table tennis player in an official competition, i have a ELO-ranking for that sport.  All the participating players can watch their ELO-points, results and statistics online all of the time.  All every club in that league has to do, is charging their own results in the system and ELO-points are automatically recalculated.  Even when there is a tournament and those results are charged later than other later results, the date of the game is taken in notice so the ELO-ranking is all of the time updated and recalculated.  To exclude 'fraude' with the results, the opponent of the player/club who gave in the results in the system, has to confirm those results.
An exemple of my not so marvellous season, for the moment:

http://competitie.vttl.be/?menu=6&sel=31902&result=1&category=1

Pretty sure you'll understand the language in the link, given the fact we speak the same language - yet, in a totally different way. :-)

For the record: i'm not suggesting to make the same kind of platform yourself - that would be way too time-consuming and keep you away of the real deal: playing Carcassonne - but I wonder if there isn't a platform online somewhere that we could use.  In that way, results and ELO-rankings would always be up to date.
And if there is a way the participants to the league games can give in themselves the results of the games online, that would decrease your work a lot - which is much appreciated by the way.

Maybe this is a helpful link?
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-free-Elo-rating-system-software

Groeten,
Thodekey

Thanks for your input Thodekey. Also for the links! I am indeed considering finding a better way to record Elo ratings, some sort of program or webpage could certainly help. Will continue to look at options.

For now, I managed to recalculate and publish a new update. I had to go through all competition threads and record as well the moment games were played. Sometimes I had to go back and forth to figure out the right order (for instance Adrornalin has played 3 games in a single evening in different leagues, and there are other examples like this). It took me a bit more than 2 hours.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on March 07, 2017, 01:59:57 AM
For now, I managed to recalculate and publish a new update. I had to go through all competition threads and record as well the moment games were played. Sometimes I had to go back and forth to figure out the right order (for instance Adrornalin has played 3 games in a single evening in different leagues, and there are other examples like this). It took me a bit more than 2 hours.

 :(y)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: jungleboy on March 07, 2017, 02:03:16 AM
For now, I managed to recalculate and publish a new update. I had to go through all competition threads and record as well the moment games were played. Sometimes I had to go back and forth to figure out the right order (for instance Adrornalin has played 3 games in a single evening in different leagues, and there are other examples like this). It took me a bit more than 2 hours.

Great dedication :) Thanks for all your work in calculating this, it's a really cool thing to have. And it's even cooler when I am higher than danisthirty.
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on April 01, 2017, 07:05:58 AM
Update: April 1st 2017

46 games have been played since the last update! (18 games in the BC&B League and 28 in the Basegame League).
For a few days in March I became first but Merlin_89 took the top position back quite quickly. I think we both had terrible games.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/e25c719b84da232e4ab59c01a5653bb7.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: thodekey on April 01, 2017, 07:12:30 AM
Hello Jéré,

Looks great work again but I can't find my name in the ranking?  Or is there a minimum of games for a player to get a ranking?

Greetings,
Thomas
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on April 01, 2017, 08:02:34 AM
Hello Jéré,

Looks great work again but I can't find my name in the ranking?  Or is there a minimum of games for a player to get a ranking?

Greetings,
Thomas

Very sorry! I forgot to transfer your name from my spreadsheet to this table.  :-\  Your Elo is 1239 (#17)

I will fix it when I'll have time because I can't right now. Apologies!  :-[
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: thodekey on April 01, 2017, 08:15:08 AM
No need to apoligize! On the contrary, a big thanks for the effort!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on April 01, 2017, 12:52:51 PM
Thanks for keeping us up to date Jere!

+1 merit for your efforts. :(y)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on April 03, 2017, 12:10:16 PM
No need to apoligize! On the contrary, a big thanks for the effort!

It's fixed now. ;)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on April 28, 2017, 08:46:47 AM
Update: April 28th 2017

32 games have been played since the last update (20 in the Basegame League and 10 in the final round of the BC&B League).

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170428/352638e92db53b96c693b2761dbaeab4.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on April 28, 2017, 11:34:16 AM
Thanks Jéré

+1 merit for the effort you've gone to updating this.

It's good to be the one with the hairy chest again... :(y)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on April 28, 2017, 11:53:20 AM
Thanks, Jéré!
What a close contest at the top of the ranking, 4 players within 10 points!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Merlin_89 on April 28, 2017, 12:16:49 PM
Indeed Leven! What a crowd at the top, things can change here rather quickly... But I'm positively surprised that I keep occupying 1st place.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: jungleboy on April 28, 2017, 12:21:52 PM
I remember the days when I was No.2 in ELO :(


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: MrNumbers on April 28, 2017, 12:32:55 PM
I remember the days when I was No.2 in ELO :(
I remember MONTHS when I was Nr.1 in ELO :'(
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on April 28, 2017, 01:05:52 PM
I remember the days when I was No.2 in ELO :(
I remember MONTHS when I was Nr.1 in ELO :'(

Yeah but then a third person came along and spoiled the fun for both of you! :D

I didn't spot it earlier, but if Jere and I were to swap places in this list, the top 5 would match the top 5 in the current leader board at the end of Round 6 of the basegame league.
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 04, 2017, 02:48:47 AM
Update: May 4th 2017

Since there is only one league running at the moment, I thought it would be worth posting another Elo update for the remaining 8 games played in Round 7 of the Basegame League, to be in synch with the completed 'milestones'.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170504/45c96c7778d7e33602de28eae61a89ec.png)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 17, 2017, 12:07:17 AM
Update: May 17th 2017

Results after Round 8 of the Basegame League.

I took advantage of the the fact that Merlin_89 was not playing this round to steal the first rank.  ;D  Not going to stay there very long but for now I enjoy the view from the summit.  8)

It has been a good round for khalid, ghl510, Halfling and Rosco but rather one to forget for Dan, Leven, What If and Adrornalin.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170517/5087a95bd40401fbb969e4fbdcf91ec3.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on May 17, 2017, 01:31:13 AM
Damn. Those two losses against khalid cost me dearly...
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 17, 2017, 02:31:15 AM
If someone is curious, the consequences of the first tie of the league were the following:
Leven    -2
glh510  +2
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 29, 2017, 08:53:07 AM
Update: May 29th 2017

Results after Round 9 of the Basegame League.

Thumbs up to Khalid for being the new leader!  :(y) :(y)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170529/9b694b378e70eb59fc8ea7d250a68ad5.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: MrNumbers on May 29, 2017, 11:39:00 PM
After almost two years I am back in TOP-3 at last! 8) :D
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: khalidqasrawi on May 29, 2017, 11:42:11 PM
My first time at the top.  I feel truly proud but somehow, I think its a fluke of the basegame league.

Khalid  :red-meeple:
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on May 30, 2017, 01:30:22 AM
Many thanks for the update Jéré - your efforts are very much appreciated!

After almost two years I am back in TOP-3 at last! 8) :D

Congrats. It's well deserved! :(y)

My first time at the top.  I feel truly proud but somehow, I think its a fluke of the basegame league.

Don't underestimate yourself dude. You deserve to be there as far as I'm concerned! :(y)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on June 14, 2017, 07:07:59 AM
Update: June 14th 2017

Results after Round 10 of the Basegame League.

All players in the top5 go down except... MrNumbers, the new leader! Well done!

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170614/25453c50534116aa62bf90a3ba8fce90.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: khalidqasrawi on June 14, 2017, 07:28:22 AM
Congratulations MrNumbers.  I knew my lead would be brief!

kq  :red-meeple:
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: MrNumbers on June 14, 2017, 10:10:59 PM
MrNumbers, the new leader! Well done!
Congratulations MrNumbers.

Thank you, guys! ;)
Home, sweet home ;D
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on July 06, 2017, 02:28:08 AM
I have done some work to generate the table I publish here automatically. The previous method involved a bit of copying/pasting and I needed to transfer the names of new participants manually so it was prone to errors. Now it is much smarter as it reads the main Elo spreadsheet directly and populates the table on the fly (I just need to specify 2 row numbers, where it starts and where it ends). One small side-effect of this change is that you will see a few 'ghosts' reappearing because I had manually removed (not from the Elo spreadsheet, just the ranking table) some players that had been inactive for 2-3 years. They are now listed again because names are read directly from the main spreadsheet.
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on July 14, 2017, 08:52:26 AM
I had some time this afternoon to update the list of the highest rated matches. For those interested here it is:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170714/c58507862e62e28b381aa5388549a323.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on July 26, 2017, 01:26:42 AM
Next Elo update will be published on August 1st (at the latest) OR as soon as the outstanding games are played in Basegame League Round 11/12. Sorry for the delay.  :-[
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on July 27, 2017, 11:34:52 PM
Update: July 28th 2017

Results after Rounds 11 and 12 of the Basegame League. This update also includes 15 games played in the Minis League.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170728/01a830ab040200d030d732b9fb7a6703.png)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on July 28, 2017, 09:34:08 AM
Wow, then I'm the new target for the "curse of the Elo leader". Luckily I've already played my games against Rich The Fish...
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Rich_The_Fish on July 29, 2017, 03:52:23 AM
Wow, then I'm the new target for the "curse of the Elo leader". Luckily I've already played my games against Rich The Fish...
emoji code106]
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Merlin_89 on September 20, 2017, 03:05:18 PM
Jere, any chance we'll get update before last round in The League?

I'd very much appreaciate it!  :(y)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on September 25, 2017, 01:42:59 AM
Jere, any chance we'll get update before last round in The League?

I'd very much appreaciate it!  :(y)

I'm also curious about my own rating, because it seems that I did well recently... unfortunately, some people decided that it was no longer important to post scores after playing: They either post several days late and in some cases not at all! This makes the task impossible to accomplish at the moment. Sorry!  :(
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on September 25, 2017, 02:12:17 AM
Jere, any chance we'll get update before last round in The League?

I'd very much appreaciate it!  :(y)

I'm also curious about my own rating, because it seems that I did well recently... unfortunately, some people decided that it was no longer important to post scores after playing: They either post several days late and in some cases not at all! This makes the task impossible to accomplish at the moment. Sorry!  :(

Are we missing any other results than that of the game jma03 vs Adrornalin?
I think we should consider a game without screenshot as if it had never happened.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on September 25, 2017, 06:08:11 AM
Sorry that your life has been made so complicated by this lately Jere. I feel your frustration.

Yes Leven, we are still waiting for the Round 14 result from Rosco and Chooselife. I understand it was a tie, but am still waiting to see screenshots and scores from Rosco...
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on October 12, 2017, 12:41:44 PM
Bad news, I was almost done but this is what happened with my work laptop this morning...

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171012/e72121abc28c19c0b2258920b42f9d2d.jpg)

Sorry!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on October 12, 2017, 01:26:40 PM
NNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111111

Just when I thought I might have had a chance of reaching a new Elo personal best :'(

(hope you didn't lose any important work things btw?)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Decar on October 13, 2017, 02:01:15 PM
With no Boot Device how are you going to kick it into shape!

Good lucky resolving your hardware issues  :'( :'(
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on October 13, 2017, 02:21:19 PM
IT guy is dealing with the problem, not me :)  the good thing is that I will get a SSD, so I'm not too sad
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Leven on December 20, 2017, 03:14:57 AM
IT guy is dealing with the problem, not me :)  the good thing is that I will get a SSD, so I'm not too sad

Jéré, could you give us some status report? Are the files completely lost? Or is there any hope about updated ELO rankings in the near future?
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 20, 2017, 03:28:24 AM
Only the update I was preparing got lost, which was about 3-4 hours of work. Fortunately I had a backup of the main elo spreadsheet. However I got quite annoyed by this loss and didn't really have the desire to start over even though 3 or 4 hours is not the end of the world... so yes there is still hope, I plan to do it before the end of this year as I will have lot of free time. My interest for online competition is pretty much gone (I think I'm officially retired now), I'll try really hard to not let this affect my interest for updating the elo scores... but the risk is definitely there...
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on December 20, 2017, 03:33:52 AM
... My interest for online competition is pretty much gone (I think I'm officially retired now) ...

No way. You're too good to retire! :'( :(n)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: MrNumbers on December 20, 2017, 03:40:40 AM
My interest for online competition is pretty much gone (I think I'm officially retired now)
Too bad, you were very good opponent.

It's completely Adrornalin's fault! ;D
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on December 20, 2017, 04:23:26 AM
(I think I'm officially retired now)

That is only something that old people like me do Jere!!!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 20, 2017, 04:32:42 AM
(I think I'm officially retired now)

That is only something that old people like me do Jere!!!

Haha Indeed I got annoyed by a few things and I'm totally becoming a grumpy old man :)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on December 20, 2017, 04:56:12 AM

Haha Indeed I got annoyed by a few things and I'm totally becoming a grumpy old man :)

I dread the thought of what you will be like when you reach my age!  >:D
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Decar on December 20, 2017, 05:02:30 AM
I've just reopened the Carcassonne Central Ladder (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=3714), now with automated administration.

Perhaps you'll consider giving that another go  :(y)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on December 20, 2017, 05:17:42 AM
I've just reopened the Carcassonne Central Ladder (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=3714), now with automated administration.

Perhaps you'll consider giving that another go  :(y)

What an excellent idea Decar. Let's hope that this works out. It looks very interesting. (I have registered).
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 20, 2017, 05:20:33 AM
I've just reopened the Carcassonne Central Ladder (http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=3714), now with automated administration.

Perhaps you'll consider giving that another go  :(y)

Very good idea. Thanks, will definitely consider.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Decar on December 20, 2017, 05:33:58 AM
Hopefully, I've sorted out a lot of the issues we had with last time we tried it, so it should be a lot smoother.
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 29, 2017, 03:53:57 AM
Update: November 28th 2017 (BEFORE the World Cup 2017)

You read well, this update does NOT include any World Cup games. It does include 66 games from Basegame and Minis Leagues played from August to October 2017. Again, sincere apologies for the delay. Another update is coming soon to take into account all WC games played so far.

Congrats to Dan for becoming the next target of the "Curse of the Elo leader".  emoji code1]

The highest rated match in the history of the Universe since the Big Bang was played on Oct 9th in the Final of the Minis League, danisthirty (Elo:1415) won against Merlin_89 (Elo:1440). Well done!

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171229/fd57d97c35da37b67de79901c17285bb.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on December 29, 2017, 04:02:57 AM
Thanks for the update Jéré! +1 merit for redoing all that hard work in light of your computer problem...

Congrats to Dan for becoming the next target of the "Curse of the Elo leader".  emoji code1]

Indeed. I believe my next game after this was against the infinitely inferior "jungleboy" who cheated by being better than me and will undoubtedly have cost me at least 1432 Elo points.

However, it's nice to see the most handsomely-bearded player back at the top of the board where he belongs, even if it wasn't for very long. And I'm glad to have taken part in the most highly-ranked Elo game as well (especially since I won it - a new experience for me). 8)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on December 29, 2017, 04:38:29 AM
Out of interest, does this include the Minis league games that were discounted due to people dropping out?
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 29, 2017, 06:13:25 AM
Out of interest, does this include the Minis league games that were discounted due to people dropping out?

All played games do count.

One example: Your game against jma03 that you have won 178-140 in the Wizards group was included in the calculation.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on December 29, 2017, 06:16:02 AM
Out of interest, does this include the Minis league games that were discounted due to people dropping out?

All played games do count.

One example: Your game against jma03 that you have won 178-140 in the Wizards group was included in the calculation.

Thanks for clarifying Jéré. I don’t often win games against guys of this quality.
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on December 29, 2017, 08:02:46 AM
Update: December 29th 2017

Elo ratings after 41 games played in the World Cup. Dan is holding on to the top position!   :(y)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171229/67708a0a2cd0100fbe68b970fb47be36.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: jungleboy on December 29, 2017, 08:09:17 AM
Dan is holding on to the top position!   :(y)

Despite his loss to lowly jungleboy.  :P

(Thanks Jéré for the update!)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on December 29, 2017, 08:58:14 AM
Thanks again Jere! (remind me how much I owe you for arranging this?)

Just out of interest, how easy would it be to produce a ranking of everyone based on the maximum Elo they have scored? I think 1431 must be the highest my Elo has ever reached but I know others have scored higher...
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on January 02, 2018, 02:08:02 AM
Just out of interest, how easy would it be to produce a ranking of everyone based on the maximum Elo they have scored? I think 1431 must be the highest my Elo has ever reached but I know others have scored higher...

Something like this? It's just the MAX function in Excel so yes that's easy.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180102/1d7259b1990ec17798996d21475d5490.jpg)

Note: Number of games played will not match your stats. I included the "Tournament in a Day" from July 2016 in the Elo spreadsheet, and I'm not sure if you keep track of the games played by the players that drop out.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: thodekey on January 10, 2018, 04:00:00 AM
Hello folks,

1 question about the ELO-points.  Do the results in the Carcassonne Central Ladder count for the ELO-ranking or is this a separate competition with a separate ranking?
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on January 10, 2018, 04:30:52 AM
I believe the Elo ratings in the Carc Ladder are managed independently of those updated here by Jéré.

Although the principle is the same, I'm not sure the same calculations/ adjustments are used in both cases.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Decar on January 10, 2018, 04:43:07 AM
Yep they're different and don't interact with each other.  The CCL values are calculated auto-magically after each game.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Chooselife on January 10, 2018, 06:38:27 AM
Does
Quote
auto-magically
means that Dan always win?
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Squiffything on January 10, 2018, 06:49:11 AM
Does
Quote
auto-magically
means that Dan always win?

No it means he always comes 4th :)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Decar on January 10, 2018, 07:29:56 AM
that could be arranged  :(y)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on February 02, 2018, 07:27:27 AM
Update: February 2nd 2018

Standings after the World Cup 2017 Group Stage. 15 games were played since last update.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180202/2dd38e8f10e601d5469814e795332adf.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: danisthirty on February 02, 2018, 07:46:05 AM
Congratulations Jéré! 8) :yellow-meeple:

1455 also looks to be a new CarcC record!
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on February 05, 2018, 12:46:46 AM
Congratulations Jéré! 8) :yellow-meeple:

1455 also looks to be a new CarcC record!

Thanks! Seems so! ...but "the curse" is whispering my name already....  :o

Although, what it doesn't know is that I have ear plugs.  :))
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 11, 2018, 12:29:53 AM
Update: May 11th 2018

Standings after the Knock-Out Stage of the World Cup 2017. 8 games were played since last update.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180511/9b3d62930ebcc9c654d11ddd89068498.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on May 11, 2018, 02:40:03 AM
Jere, is there any chance that you could include the results from the 'Alternative World Cup' in your rankings too, as these were 'real games' played in a 'real competition'?

Thanks.  :)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 11, 2018, 02:44:16 AM
Jere, is there any chance that you could include the results from the 'Alternative World Cup' in your rankings too, as these were 'real games' played in a 'real competition'?

Thanks.  :)

Yes absolutely! I thought about asking if you wanted that some time ago but then I forgot. Sorry. I'll try my best to add them today, otherwise next week I promise.
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on May 11, 2018, 02:58:19 AM
Jere, is there any chance that you could include the results from the 'Alternative World Cup' in your rankings too, as these were 'real games' played in a 'real competition'?

Thanks.  :)

Yes absolutely! I thought about asking if you wanted that some time ago but then I forgot. Sorry. I'll try my best to add them today, otherwise next week I promise.

Thank you my friend. I think that the guys will really appreciate it!  :(y)
Title: Elo ratings
Post by: Jéré on May 11, 2018, 05:52:56 AM
Update: May 11th 2018  (take 2)

Second update for today, this time to include all 13 games played in the Alternative World Cup.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180511/8188f83ee5582d04c8ed15c384b510df.jpg)
Title: Re: Elo ratings
Post by: TheSteveAllen on May 11, 2018, 05:57:35 AM
Thanks for doing this Jere. Even if I have gone down (again).  :(