Author Topic: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015  (Read 68974 times)

Offline Hounk

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #90 on: October 15, 2015, 08:07:37 AM »
I would say yes, sure, but at least one of the Halflings would need to be connected to a 5th one, otherwise there is no way, this 4 tiles could have been placed legally.

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #91 on: October 15, 2015, 08:10:10 AM »
By logical extension this completed cloister is now worth 16 points.

Also is this cloister now not complete?  It can only be completed when the last halfling is added?


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Offline jungleboy

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #92 on: October 15, 2015, 08:11:48 AM »

WHAT?! A contradiction in the extended rules of Carcassonne? I never thought I'd see the day...

This is not the first time HiG has decided to change its mind on rulings of expansion interaction.  Recall the Dragon was updated twice in 24hrs when a rule clarification was published earlier this year:  http://www.carcassonnecentral.com/community/index.php?topic=1677.0

Contradictions are not great of course, but changing rules is a good thing if it leads to better rules.

Offline Decar

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #93 on: October 15, 2015, 09:08:07 AM »
I agree jungleboy  :(y)
@Hounk, yes there should be at least one more halfling connecting it to the main, forgive my mspaint skills. Perhaps this makes Barns easier to place as they are harder to stop given their limited number.

To add, the barn placement on the left is acceptable;so it follows, the barn placements in the centre and right are acceptable, because we have shown that a halfling tile is connected to a tile at a corner:

Edit: "When a player places a tile so that four field corners meet,he may place a barn instead of placing a follower."
« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 10:34:00 AM by Decar »

Offline aenima

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #94 on: October 16, 2015, 07:06:31 AM »
At Spiel 2015 in Essen I talked with HiG - Georg Wild.

I told him, that the triangle tiles give us many problems...
I put two triangle tiles together. On each triangle tile is a road segment - both road segments continued the road:
I asked Georg Wild: How many points it this road worth?
He answered: 2 points

Georg Wild then looked at me - his eyes wide open - and then his great answer:
If the road segments on triangle tiles are worth 1 point, than each triangle tile is worth 1 point in the surrounding of a cloister.

So... a city like that scores 12 points?

Offline JT Atomico

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #95 on: October 16, 2015, 03:08:29 PM »
2-Tiler checking in! I'll house rule that way no matter the outcome. And two halflings will make 1 tile. I agree with Dan, it's about the area of the playing field and the aesthetics around that.

Offline danisthirty

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #96 on: October 17, 2015, 12:32:00 AM »
2-Tiler checking in! I'll house rule that way no matter the outcome. And two halflings will make 1 tile. I agree with Dan, it's about the area of the playing field and the aesthetics around that.

Welcome to the light side Jamie! :(y)  I'll PM you about the secret handshake... :))

Offline MrNumbers

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #97 on: October 18, 2015, 02:39:20 AM »
It took me a long time to read this thread. So, I am in 2-tiler camp also.
But I have another interesting question: why we need GC tile in this example? The barn can be placed even without it: 4 tile meet in one point. But half of a barn would be on a table rather than on the landscape - are we OK with that?
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Offline Guy

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #98 on: October 18, 2015, 02:44:51 AM »
My opinion is that having all things considered based on the number of tiles rather than the size of the tiles makes life a lot simpler. Having said that it needs to be applied consistently and as close as possible to existing rules.

With that in mind I believe, (having accepted the one tile premise) that the main area that needs clarification is the placement of barns. I don't agree with one of kettle fish's images for this reason (the one with the castle, a normal tile, and two halflings), to me that should be perfectly legal. Essentially it comes down to this: Does it have to be at the intersection of only 4 tiles or at least 4 tiles?

Those are my thoughts.
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Offline Rosco

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #99 on: October 18, 2015, 03:14:17 AM »
If all tiles are one tile then what about the count start city tiles/tile?  Just throwing it out there. I don't know the rules of the count so I don't know if it would make any difference but I suppose it could for cloister scoring.
Just lay the damn tile!

Offline benbever

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #100 on: October 18, 2015, 04:19:49 AM »
The count/wheel start board is a board consisting of (representing) 12/16 tiles. That's what the white lines are for. This is already in the rules.

The topic seems to have changed from the german castles being (and counted as) 1 tile, to the idea of the halfling tiles now counting as 1 tile. (They seem to count for 1 point in road and city scoring, so why not for cloisters and other things?)
I gave that some thought (cloisters scoring more than 9 points, dragon movement resticted a bit) and because of the divide being diagonal it wouldn't give much troubles. The only one I can think of is the flier when coming in diagonally. It would land between the half tiles, but that can be solved by having it just choose one.
The only reason why I wouldn't like it is because the printed rules already clearly state two halfs in one square count as 1 tile, and 1 point for cloisters.

Offline kettlefish

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #101 on: October 18, 2015, 04:44:04 AM »
more than one landscape tile on one tile ?
here are some pictures...

Offline Guy

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #102 on: October 19, 2015, 02:10:24 AM »
What impact do the new rules have regarding halflings being scored as individual tiles have on the following:

1. The tower. If you have a gap the tower can jump it as part of it's range. If you had one halfling tile does the remaining triangular gap count as a whole tile when considering the range of the tower? Same question only with two halfling tiles next to each other - is that a tower range of one for the first time and then two for the second halfling tile?

2. The dragon. Do the halfling tiles count as one tile in respect to dragon movement? Previously i thought two next to each other counted as a single tile and therefore only one tile for dragon movement. Will two halfling tiles next to each other count as two movements now? Equally can the dragon move over a triangular gap created by a halfling tile or can it only cross onto a tile by a whole tile edge?

Guy
« Last Edit: October 19, 2015, 08:33:55 AM by Guy »

Offline Safari

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #103 on: October 21, 2015, 05:32:17 PM »
2-Tiler checking in! I'll house rule that way no matter the outcome. And two halflings will make 1 tile. I agree with Dan, it's about the area of the playing field and the aesthetics around that.

Welcome to the light side Jamie! :(y)  I'll PM you about the secret handshake... :))
After reading all of this amazing discussion (at CarcF we had a similar debate on the Halflings in late 2014) I have to admitt that I'm on the 2-tilers side as well. For me "the grid" has always been a fundamental part of the Carcassonne experience, and also will in the Future. The new HiG "1 tile policy" clearly breaks with this fundamental Carcassonne constitutional law. However, I'm glad that at least after that clarification we don't apply double standards for Halflings (two half tiles count as one complete tile) and the German Castles (one double-tile counts as one complete tile as well).
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Offline Whaleyland

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Re: Clarification of rules - with HiG - 08 10 2015
« Reply #104 on: October 21, 2015, 05:52:52 PM »
2-Tiler checking in! I'll house rule that way no matter the outcome. And two halflings will make 1 tile. I agree with Dan, it's about the area of the playing field and the aesthetics around that.
Also agree. Despite a few logical reasons for considering the German Castle to be a single "tile", most of the reasons defy logic. Does this, in effect, also mean that standard Castles (from BC&B) convert the two tiles into one since they seamlessly merge the two parts of the City into one Castle? I think not. Likewise, I will continue to treat German Castles as two tiles for function's sake, and I seriously doubt many others will adopt or assume the new official interpretation of the tiles' rules.


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